Hitman84

So, my very first statment is either gonna make me alot of friends or enemies
I work at a local walmart and recently took over management of the pet department. For the last 3 weeks I've been feeding the fish, maintaining tanks etc and it really made me want one of my own.

Yesterday we got first shipment of fish in since I took over and some of the betta were awesome looking.

So, because I live in a small.....VERY small house Im thinking that's the best bet with a 5 gallon vertical hex tank.

Questions I had were

What kind of catfish can I use for a bottom feeder to help keep her clean, I know the pictus get much too big, but what about the synodontis lace, the ones I received for example were VERY small, smaller then I thought they'd be?

Also, most fish I know you rest the bag in the water for good amount of time, let the water temperature adjust.
At work...we sell Betta for example in their little bowls they're shipped with, what'd be the best way to introduce him to the new enviorment?

Shawnie

welcome to fishlore!!

heres a great cheat sheet for betta care Important Betta Topics - Read First!

some betta will accept cories or ottos but not much else...also the hex shouldnt be a vertical one as the bettas need surface air to breath and like more of a longer than a taller tank....

best way to introduce him to his new home, is slowly acclimate him with a bit of his new tank water in his bag, every 20 mins or so.... goodluck !

serissime

When we acclimate a betta to its new tank in a cup like the ones Walmart gives, we just float the cup. It actually floats. (I was surprised anyways)

So you're getting a 5g.... make sure you also pick up a heater and filter. Do you know what the nitrogen cycle is? If not, Fishlore has many informative articles.

As for other fish, synos will get much too large. a 5g's "footprint" (ie floorspace) isn't big enough for something like cory cats either. No fish is going to just "clean up," but I like to have a "bottom dweller" too. Your betta may be okay with a trio of Oto cats, but you should only add Otos after your tank has been cycled for a few months and has sufficient algae for them to eat.

Hmmm any more questions?

Re: Shawnie:
I think the hex will be okay for a betta. A 5g hex won't be THAT tall, and the OP can put broad-leafed plants for the betta to sleep on closer the surface if it is a concern. We have betta ladies in a 20H and they use the vertical room too. Our bettas swim in the middle/top levels of their tanks.

Hitman84

I MIGHT be able to get a 10 gal long to fit but it'd be pushing it.
Part of the reason I was looking at the 5 gal hex is my father has one that he's not useing.

as for nitrogen cycle I saw bits and pieces of it and do know that a tank has to cycle for at least 24 hours before adding it's new occupants.

Shawnie

the cycle will take minimum of 7-10 days with tetra safestart (instant bacteria) and could take weeks if cycling with fish...so reading the nitrogen cycle link will help you even more

serissime

I would definitely look into Tetra Safestart. I had to order it in because none of our LFS had it.... and ended up not having to use it... but now I have it just in case I have a cycle crash.

When you read to let it cycle for 24 hours before adding fish, I think the instructions there are for mechanical reasons. You want to make sure the filter, heater, etc are working by letting them run before you do anything else. I'm pretty sure those instructions have nothing to do with the nitrogen cycle.

Hitman84

got the tank from my dad. needs a good cleaning before I do anything. Warm water and salt I've been told will be fine. Got a heater, regulates at 78% without adjustment, not sure I like that, may get another, saw some like to have theirs to 80 for the fish.

Need some colonizer(or something like)...for the cycle. other then that find the right beta for me. The one I would have chose on the spot was sold at work almost immediately.

Chrisson

Congratulations on getting the pet department! A betta will help you alot in learning about fish keeping and educate your employees and consumers to have a great fishkeeping experience that you soon will as well! Remember to learn about other fish as well not just bettas to give the ones in the store a happy life until sold!

Remember that some cycling products are faulty like for example Nutrafin Cycle which is sadly on every LFS shelves... Tetra Safe Start will give a safe start as said on the product's name and is one of the best ways to go and is recommended by most although I have never used it before. I read that the bacteria can die while still in the container so if there is a date of manufacture pick up the one closest to the current date. Kind of like buying bread of the shelves.

I was wondering, do employees get trained before they sell fish or other living creatures?

Hitman84

mmm,
We're trained on the safe and most stressless way to transfer fish from tank to bag.
We've got instrunctions basically for how to maintain and take care of the fish and most of the labels give tidbits of information.
Also what most people will never realize is the fish are priced so that it's meant to be idiot proof. basically any fish with the same last digit in the price will be ok together. different last digits doesnt mean they won't be...
For the most part the fish don't stick around long enough for real major care to be done. they sell, the tanks empty. get cleaned and then restocked

With beta's it's tougher. Our vendor, as most im sure, have a minumum order requirement for each fish, for betta for example it's 18, it's why they're shipped in the cups(yes, it sucks) but how else could it be done, yanno? We don't even have 18 tanks and obviously they can't be shipped in the same bags. Sometimes the cups are half empty and I add a bit more water for them so they aren't forced to flop around, talk about torture.

agabr123

the only "colonizer" that works the way it's intended and doesn't need to be added every single week for the life of the tank is tetra safe start mentioned above, so IMO save your money and don't buy anything else except for either prime or stress coat + as your water conditioner, and a few basic meds (depending on what you can afford, maracyn and maracyn II, jungle buddies tabs, and something for parasites, i think mardel is a good one for that). you'll also need to get yourself a good test kit (API freshwater master kit is the best one IMO), and you'll want something for a source of ammonia for the tank (if you decide not to go with the safe start). you can use either fish food, pure ammonia, or a piece of raw shrimp, and you'll want to test your levels every 5 days or so to see where you are in the cycle.

for when you get your betta (when you get consistent readings of 0ppm ammonia, 0ppm nitrite, and 5-20ppm nitrate), you'll want to get either hikari or atisons pellets, some frozen bloodworms, frozen brine shrimp, and frozen daphnia. (freeze dried brine shrimp and bloodworms are okay, but can bloat your betta easily and aren't as nutritional). generally you'll want to give your betta 3-4 pellets twice a day, and then substitute one meal a week with 3-4 bloodworms, one meal a week with some daphnia, and one meal every 2-3 weeks with brine shrimp. that's what i do for all my bettas and it provides plenty of variety for them. you'll also want to consider fasting your betta one day a week, as they do have a tendency to get constipated and bloated.

Hitman84

well, I picked up stability from seachem, thought prime and it were the same item. petsmart didnt have tetra safestart.
Also grabbed some stressscoat+

For food I got Hikari freeze dried bloodworms and Hikari Beta bio-gold pellets. Also picked up the API pH Test liquid Kit. Really didn't have $30 for the master kit

agabr123

you can return the stability, the stress coat + is all you need. honestly, i'd return the pH tester as well and get the other tests in this order of importance, ammonia, nitrite, and nitrate. pH isn't absolutely critical at this point as long as you acclimate your betta long enough

Hitman84

ph kit I got from work so it's not a huge deal, was surprised we carried it. discount works for me.

serissime

Stress coat+ detoxes chlorine, chloramines, and ammonia, but the aloe vera can be tough on betta's labyrinth organs. If you can, I'd get Prime. (You get more for your money anyways.) If you already opened the Stress Coat, I'd just use that, and next time buy Prime.

The food sounds good, the pellets there should be your staple food. The freeze dried bloodworms are good, but might get him bloated if fed too often.

Have you decided how you want to cycle your tank yet? I agree with Alex; you should try to at least buy those three tests.

Hitman84

I've been across my freaking county looking for safestart. Im wondering if I should order it online with over night or just set tank up and throw some food in.

serissime

Safestart is REALLY hard to find... which is DUMB because LFS and walmarts could make BANK on it if they just marketed it instead of ignoring the fact that cycling exists! Ordering it and starting it immediately is going to be the easiest way to go if you're willing to get it. When you use Safestart, you are going to need your betta from day one.

haedra

Indeed... I ended up ordering it online, because nowhere near where I live carry it at all.

Hitman84

So, if I setup the tank tonight, throw some bloodshrimp in tonight to get it started. if I get the safestart it has to go in with the betta?

serissime

Yes, you have to start the Safestart with the fish. It just makes the cycle harmless to the fish.

I don't know if it would be a good or bad idea to start the cycle with bloodshrimp in the meantime. What is bloodshrimp? You want to make sure there's nothing contaminating the food you use either. If you decide to cycle without safestart, you really need to get the liquid tests right away. With safestart, you have a week's downtime to get it.

Hitman84

is it ok to have the tank running? sunday is really the only day I have to get this done.
Ordered safesmart from that petplace. tank is ready to go except for water.

Chrisson

Safe start is needed, it would make it faster but if your were to add your fish right away it's pretty much mandatory unless if you want to do water changes every day.

Nothings wrong with a tank full of water so why not.

Hitman84

Well, tank is up and running, filter looks good, heater is working all is well though I think I need to move the larger plant out from under the filter waterfall. Safestart is on the way with two day shipping, so be good I hope.

Hitman84

naturally, the very last store I go to carries safestart. my internet order already shipped but I bought it anyway because right down the road petco had this gorgeous blue and yellow half moon. So, all is here, need to adjust some stuff put my bubble wand in, dump the safestart and then add the little guy....


have really newbie question. power went out while I was out and home. should the filter be causing air bubbles on top of the surface of the water at the water re-entry point?
It is because the waterline isn't close enough to the water exit? or too close?

Hitman84

posted in wrong section >.>

serissime

About the power outage, was the water still running or was the motor grinding? If the waterfall is just pushing bubbles down with the flow, that wasn't caused by the power outage, it's just surface agitation, which is fine. I try to keep the water level as close to the water exit as possible, although I hardly ever top off between water changes.

Hitman84

power went out and filter wasnt running at all. it kind of screwed up the battery backup the filter was plugged into. the filter is pushing out normal water, no bubbles. tank is on a dresser which is slightly unlevel. but water line is just below where water falls out. Also have a flexible bubble wand in there and it seems to make things worse. posted a picture of the bubbles in thread here.
First Betta

Someone suggested it could be a product of too much declorinater, which is odd cuz I thought I measured stresscoat properly. Im wondering if I should remove some of the water and add strait tap? no stress coat? Not sure if this is the proper thing to do and if it could hurt the tetra safestart process.

Fishies-for-me

That was me...lol..but if you measured properly then it would not be the conditioner...never have used safe start so It might be that but I can't testify to that one way or the other.

Oh and no do not add straight tap water. If you added the proper amount of declor then that would be a bad thing...good luck.

Hitman84

so, lets say by pure chance that it was wrong amount, who knows? whats best way to deal with it? water change once the safe start does it's 7-10 thing Im guessing.

snowball

wait is tetra safe start in one of those little bottles not in the fridge? I thought i saw it at wal-mart oneday

Lucy

It's not in the fridge, but I don't think walmart carries it.