TheOneAndOnly

Hey All,

This is my first post to Fishlore, but I've been reading on a regular basis for the past four months. I have two questions, but first I'll give background.

I started a 30 gallon freshwater tank in early June. I followed all of the rules for cycling, and started with BioSpira and 6 leopard danios. I use a whisper power filter, change 40% of the water every two weeks, have standard heating equipment, etc. My ammonia, nitrite, and nitrate levels are always where they should be.

In NYC I have very soft water (literally registers a hardness of zero), and my natural pH from the tap is between 6.5 and 7.0. I use AquaSafe for water treatment. My 30 gallon now houses 5 danios (one was lost along the way, but not due to cycling), 4 cory cats, 1 otto, 1 dwarf gourami, and 1 german balloon ram. They were added every few weeks throughout the summer.

My problem/question is...for the past few weeks, my ph seems to drop fairly low. I use a liquid testing kit as well as dip-sticks, and at times it seems to register a deeper yellow that is 'off-the-chart' below the 5.0 that the chart lists. If I do a partial water change with my 6.5/7.0 tap water, it bumps up the ph for a few days to maybe 6.3, but it falls shortly thereafter.

Any ideas as to what causes this? It didn't seem to happen before I added the german ballon ram approx 1 month ago. Could this 12th fish be adding to the bio-load and reducing the ph? I also have two pieces of store-purchased driftwood, but they aren't enormous, and they've been in the tank since day one without problems.

Since I have neutral PH tap water with no hardness, should I start adding things to the water to stabilize it (raise PH and/or hardness)? I have heard that it can be a BIGGER problem to be constantly 'fixing' things with additives, and that sometimes it's better for the fish to simply adapt to your common conditions. My question though is, how low is too low with the ph? If it seems to be 5.0 or lower, I would assume that is dangerous. The fish show no signs of stress, and seem to act normal throughout this entire period.

Secondly, my poor german balloon ram (which I wouldn't have purchased had I realized that the 'balloon' was simply a preferred genetic defect, but you live & you learn) is CONSTANTLY chased by my dwarf male gourami. Everything I read before purchasing seemed to state that the gouramis are usually only aggressive to other male gouramis. In fact, I expected to be on the lookout for the german ram to be snippy with the cory cats. The german balloon ram always can outrun my gourami and rarely gets nipped. (The ram's fins are all totally intact.) Is there any way to fix this? I tried rearranging the tank so that they would have a 'clean slate' as far as territory, but that hasn't done anything. Should I get a female gourami for the male gourami? Should I get another ram so that there are two together to stand up to the gourami? The only issue with that is that I don't know if I have a male or female german balloon ram. It seems to be tougher to tell with the balloon varieties.

Sorry for this MASSIVE novel of a post, but these are two questions that I have wanted to ask for a few weeks ago and didn't have the time. I hope you experts out there can help me out!

Thanks so very much,
Josh

Barbrella

Hi and welcome! I'm sure some experts will be along to help you, but in the meantime here's a few questions/suggestions.

What are you ammonia, nitrite and nitrate readings?

Do you do gravel vacuuming with your water changes?

As you surmise, adding chemicals to raise pH is a very bad idea, as that will cause a roller coaster effect on the level.

I would do 25% water changes once a week, and use Prime as the water conditioner.

Are you overfeeding your fish? How much and how often do you feed them?

That's the last thing you should do. A male gourami with a bubblenest full of eggs will become extremely aggressive, to the point of killing some tankmates.

Gouramis vary in aggressiveness, from none to severe. Usually, as you see, there is no damage done, but harassed fish can die from the stress. Lots of plants, driftwood etc to break up the viewing range of the tank may help.

Some fish like bettas and Dwarf gouramis may go after other fish that have similar colours to them in a case of mistaken identity.

If nothing works, you may have to take one of them back to the petstore.

TheOneAndOnly

Thanks for the quick & helpful reply! To answer your questions:

My readings usually are Ammonia 0, Nitrite 0, Nitrate btwn 5-20, usually on the lower end.

I do use a gravel vacuum with the water changes, and I get a lot of junk coming up.

I will pick up Prime for my next water change, and try switching to the 25% weekly changes.

I don't THINK I'm overfeeding, but I'm never sure exactly how much to use, so I guess it is possible. I use Omega One Freshwater Flakes and Veggie Kelp Flakes. (About 70% freshwater flakes /30% kelp flakes.) I try to keep it to two pinches, equaling maybe 1/4 tsp? I'd have to measure to be sure. I do the flakes every day, occassionally missing one day. I know of the two minute rule, and it seems like I'm usually pretty close to that. For the corys, every other day I use algae wafers, either one or two. So I guess on average, maybe 4-7 little sinking wafers per week, which the danios and gourami also munch on.

Thanks!

mitch

do you have any driftwood in the tank? That can lower the ph

Barbrella

What kind are you using? I've noticed that some brands break down into dust that will not be eaten and could foul a tank.

Plus, corys are not algae eaters. I would use Hikari Sinking wafers/Shrimp pellets for bottom feeders instead. Hikari brand doesn't disintegrate in the tank, making for much cleaner water!

You could still give them an algae wafer once in awhile.

pepetj

It's easier to raise pH than lower it. As for adding chemicals, well, everything is chemical if we give it some thought.

Your pH is going down because your water lacks buffering qualities, the impact of your bio-load might have some correlation or not, but I don't see that as the main reason for this to happen. There are trace mineral solutions for FW use (e.g. API has a few) and you can safely use baking soda, just make sure you measure your "chemically tampered" water BEFORE you put it in your tank. A very small, tiny tiny bit, of baking soda will raise your KH significantly, so with a KH liquid reagent test at hand (don't trust strip for this) measure until you get 3 or 4 DKH; if you exceed this point, just dilute with your source water. Aim somewhere around 6 to 8 for dGH.

Place an airstone (to aid in water movement) while you let your water sit overnight, test again, and add to your tank. Keep measuring for a few days.

With time, all tanks get depleted of trace minerals, that will happen even faster if your source water has zero GH/KH.

Some fishkeepers rather use crushed corals (from the SW section) to increase KH. If you are going to go this way, rinse very well to remove traces of marine salt, just in case.

I see no problems in using good chemical products (e.g. pH Up) even if I have never used them. I have read posts by serious and reputable fishkeepers (e.g. Tom Barr) recommending them as safe and wise to use. Just use them carefully since if you go way up, it will be a hard work to take it back down, and sudden pH swings will affect the health, even kill, your life-stock.

Pepe
Santo Domingo

seedy

Hi oneandonly
As pepetj mentioned , you can use crushed coral . I have done this for my axolotl tank by adding it to one of the compartments in my external filter .
Hope this helps

Jess

Welcome to Fishlore Josh. Your first post is a very good one.
Hi, I live in Ct. my water is also very soft zero GH/KH but I seem to maintain 6.4 pH. I have discus and change 40-50% water twice a week. I think that helps stabilize and maintain the pH, with the changes it adds minerals back in that are naturally in the water.
Maybe you should consider an extra water change? Did I read you change your water every two weeks? Try once a week and see if your pH is more stable. Its really difficult to get all the waste vacuumed up, and its possible that its still affecting your pH.
Did you mention you have drift wood? If you do, I would try and remove it and see if that helps. Also as pepetj and seedy mentioned adding crushed coral helps to raise pH slowly. I actually added a shell to my molly tank to raise pH and removed driftwood. It worked. They have a more comfortable pH for them now.
Finding a balance naturally will make your fish keeping so much easier.
Cheers!
Jess

SkyCrystal

I used Neutral Regulator for my water when the ph started to drop. It worked like a charm. The good thing about Neutral Regulator is that it can fix high or low ph, always taking it back to 7.0. However, I suggest going with a natural fix before trying any chemicals. Although Neutral Regulator would be the fastest, I think it's better to try some of the other suggestions. If everything else fails, then go for Neutral Regulator.