Laelanna

In our 55 gallon we would like to put a fish that will eat feeder guppies. We got some to get the cycle on the tank started and because we figured that any that lived would get eaten by the BGKF. Well, the problem is, while we think he may be eating the babies, the adults are still alive, kicking, and hogging tank space. So, I need something that will eat these. We also have Fancy guppies and Cories in the tank, danios too, but they will be moved as soon as we get a net to catch the fast little suckers for the other tank. We have been looking at an African Butterfly fish but have to wait until payday to get some plexiglass to put over the top of the tank to keep anything from jumping out. Any other suggestions would be great. I can move the guppies if needed, but the other tank is onliy a 20 gallon and I don't want to put too much in there and with the guppies all getting ready to drop its going to get crowded fast.

witt0018

To start, you shouldn't use fish to cycle a tank. Ok, they are only feeder guppies, but they have lived through tank cycling, surely they are worthy of a good life after that?

if they have goy too big, then you will need big fish to eat them.

Shawnie

pretty much any fish that you aquire to eat feeder guppies, will eat ANYTHING in that tank...what are your stocking plans after the guppies are eaten?

butterfly's are amazing fish but as you must know, are super jumpers so a cover is a must....they will eat any live food that fits in their mouth

Laelanna

I don't know what all he plans to put in that tank other than a couple of angel fish. I eventually want to move my cory's and guppies out of there, but that will have to wait until I can come up with the money for one of those 40 gallon double tank stands and one of the 40 gallon tanks for it. :P The only problem I have with the butterfly is that the ones at the LFS are still kinda small maybe 3" tops, and I don't know if they could eat the guppies. We have looked at a couple of eels, but we were worried how they would get along with the bgkf and whether they would go after the other fish. I just need more tanks... and money.

As for the feeder guppy cycling, well he was going to cycle it with something. Figured if he killed off something that was going to get eaten if it didn't die, it wasn't too big of a loss. The 20 gallon is in the midst of its own cycling, but I started it off with a good bit of water from the 55 gallon and it seems to be doing well so far. I have to get him to use the drop tests to test it so I know actual stats on it though.

Shawnie

well, this is my suggestion...whether you take it or not, is your choice

whatever fish you put in to eat your "feeders", has to be compatable with what your future plans are...an angel and a butterfly arent a good combo..neither is an eel with an angel...I would scoop up all the feeders, and take them to your LFS and give them to them..they will take them for free ....then stock your tank with the fish you want...if your cycle isnt complete, id continue cycleing without fish and just feed the tank daily with fish food...even if cyceling with "feeder" fish not caring about if they die or not, isnt something most of us here care to do..you can cycle with food or a piece of small fresh shrimp and you dont need to do it with live fish

David C

I'm sorry, but I feel the death of any fish through ammonia poisoning is a big loss. I've cycled several tanks with fish, but I've also used tetra safestart to take care of the ammonia and they've all cycled in a matter of days. Only under these conditions would i consider using fish, and my latest tank i still used ammonia drops even though i used the safestart. i didnt want to stress my bettas for no reason.

Sorry, but I dont like torturing fish... and thats what ammonia poisoning is, torture.

Laelanna

The fish were not exposed to ammonia for long, my hubby did water changes to lower it and within a day or two it was gone and the nitrites are low, I don't remember him saying anything about them getting very high at all. And we didn't buy them for the sole purpose of cycling the tank. They were bought as feeders and we were hoping to be able to get a tank set just for them to feed to the bgkf, we just didn't realize he would be so small and not able to eat them for a good while yet. We don't have the money to get another tank set up right now for them to reproduce or the need for them yet, as we had thought.

And, as I said, its not my tank and my hubby was going to cycle it with something, they just happened to be the cheapest things I could find. I didn't ask for your accusations that I'm being cruel, just what I could feed them to. I'm sorry you don't agree with mine or my husbands decision, but accusing us of something when you don't know how we handled everything is uncalled for and rude. He makes very sure that the ammonia and nitrites are staying low and doing partial water changes if its not acceptable. Considering we ended up with about 40+ instead of the 24 I asked for and only lost 3 or 4 of them, I don't think that could be considered torture. Feeders aren't the best taken care of fish in any fish store and I would have expected a higher death rate just from bringing them home.


Thanks Shawnie, I let him know the African butterfly wasn't compatible with the angels. Too bad because those are really cool fish. Maybe when I get my own tank I can look into stocking one around a butterfly fish. I figured the eel wouldn't get along with most fish anyway, was just a hopeful thought. I just wish I had the money to set up another tank just to breed them in so I could have them down the road for the bgkf. Even as cheap as they are, some pay days its not something we can reasonably afford. three, soon to be four kids, plays havoc with a budget sometimes. Especially when things like school shopping and christmas come around.

Ghostfish

Well, since its my tank in question I will cover the specifics.

#1) The ammonia levels never exceeded .3mg/L in a 24 hour period. Water changes were performed to keep the cycle safe for the fish.

#2) The breeder guppies were bought as food. I expected to get a larger black ghost knifefish than what I ended up with. I was hoping for something around 6-7 inches, but I ended up with a little 3 inch guy. He has been eating the fry, but the others are too big. Since these feeders don't look to be the healthiest in the world, I am trying to protect the other fish from potential disease.

#3) We only lost around 3 guppies. We also lost a couple corys. I really doubt they died from ammonia poisoning. I believe they died due to lack of oxygen in the water. I was used to using a dual bio-wheel filter and switched to a canister filter for more filtration. Usually the water falling from the output of the bio-wheel filter added enough oxygen to the water for the fish. I did not think about that loss in oxygen by switching to the canister filter.

Anyway, I ensure you there is no cruelity involved here. My water conditions are most likely better than those at the pet store I got them from. I guarantee they were better fed and had much more room. They went from a small 20 gallon crowded tank to a nice, cushy 55 gallon fully planted tank. They probably had weeks added to their lives. It definitely has to beat being pushed through an oscar's digestive tract.

David C

I think I may be confused. You added 40+ feeder guppies to a 55gal uncycled tank with some cories and a knifefish? i keep re-reading and see the same part that the tank was uncycled...

I have no problem with feeding fish to other fish, its part of the natural order. i just dont like putting fish through the ammonia (not a part of the natural order), especially when people know better. ive done it myself when i was ignorant and i didnt even do the water changes, and i feel terrible for the guppies that i killed.

Chief_waterchanger

Okay, first I must say that a debate is always good, but lets be careful how far towards hostile we take this, folks. (On both sides of the arguement, I mean.)

Cycling with fish is considered, by most, a cruel act, that's just how it is and that is what they were telling you. They aren't trying to accuse you or villianize you, just educate you. (And I guarantee, we are all still learning, even those that have 40+ years in the hobby still learn on a daily basis.)

Be careful what goes with the black ghost knife fish, because they will eat small fish. Also, I know you probably already know this, but they get fairly large, almost 2 feet in length, sometimes. With said size they usually are considered to need nothing smaller than a 75g, and would really do best in a 100-150g+ tank.

The idea of taking the feeders back to the store is a good one, and probably the best way to get them out of your tank quickly. Most places sell feeder guppies for around 10 per $3 or so, or atleast, places around me... So you aren't missing out on much money there.

Ghostfish

The tank was cycled before adding anything but guppies. The guppies multiplied a couple times with the first couple of days increasing there numbers. As everyone knows, breeder guppies are not generally a healthy fish. The fact that 3 out of 30 or so died shows the water conditions must have been acceptable. They are still in very good shape. I have experience with fishless cycling and cycling with fish. Fishless cycling is an easier method, but since I am very careful about water conditions I cycled with the guppies.

The guppies we will likely just take back. They were a dozen for $1, so its not a big deal.

Laelanna

We do plan to get a larger tank eventually. I'm hoping that maybe around tax return time we can swing it, but we will have to see. Either that or finding one at a yardsale or something like that.

I know that most don't care to cycle with fish, but the tank had been set up for a week or so already before we added any fish. My hubby was also very careful about water conditions and made sure that the fish were doing alright. The cory's and bgkf were not added until the parameters were acceptable for them. I myself was worried about the cycling being done with added a 20$ fish, but I didn't complain and my hubby has done great with the fish.