jdhef

Your ammonia won't reach zero until you build up enough ammonia eating bacteria to convert the ammonia to nitrites, at which point you'll be testing positive for nitites. Your in a bit of a pickle, since your tap water contains ammonia, so daily water changes are impractical/too expensive.

If the Zeolite removes the ammonia, you'll never build up the bacteria colony that you need to convert ammonia to nitrites.

I'm not sure, and I would love someone elses opinion on this, but at this point you might just be better off trying to get some BioSpira or Safe Start. When I bought BioSpira at mylfs it was only $12 for a packet that would cycle 30 gallons. That would probably be cheaper than Zeolite and bottled/R.O. water.

Oh well, I hope I helped a little. Good luck.

scorpiogirl

I think you are right about my tank not being able to cycle as long as I am using the Zeolite to take ammonia out but I don't know anything about using BioSpira or SafeStart. Will it harm the fish? Do I need to stop using the Zeolite and when I do, will the ammonia level harm the fish? Can you take me step by step through what I should do? Am open to any and all suggestions because I am clueless here. Thanks in advance for all your help!

Lucy

I've never heard of Zeolite, but what John said sounds right.

Another member has ammonia in her tap water, if I remember correctly, the Prime takes care of it.

Ammonia can kill your fish, so now that you've decided to add fish to an uncycled tank, you'll need to do 50% water changes daily.
Get yourself an API Master kit and test daily keeping track of the reults.

You'll see ammonia rise then begin to fall, at which point you'll see nitrites rise....which also can be deadly to fish.....then you'll begin to see nitrates.
When your ammonia and nitrites fall to 0 with some nitrates showing, your tank will be cycled.

This takes time, longer with fish than without, so be patient and do your daily water changes, you owe it to your fish.

I don't have experience with Bio-Spira or Safe Start, I'll let someone who knows about it comment on it.

Look luck.

jdhef

I think that you would need to stop using the Zeolite if you add BioSpira/Safe Start. BioSpira/Safe Start needs the ammonia to feed the bacteria it contains. With BioSpira/Safe Start you add the fish at the same time you add the BS/SS so it won't harm your fish (and once again needs the ammonia that the fish produce to feed off of).

Of course that is assuming it works properly. I used BS for my 5 gallon Betta tank, and while I am getting no ammonia, I am getting nitrites, so I'm doing daily 50% water changes.

scorpiogirl

Ok, I am really confused here. I have given this info before, but just in case anyone is not aware of my situation let me recap. My 26 gallon tank has been set up for 4weeks and not knowing anything about the nitrogen cycle, I added in fish right off the bat. I have a total of 12 fish, 1 rubbernosed pleco, 6 neon tetras, 3 male guppies, 2 female platies.
My ammonia level was about 0.50 for a few weeks and my lfs said to add Zeolite carbon into the filter to help lower the ammonia. I did so and the ammonia went down to less than 0.20. However, now the ammonia is back up again to 0.25 and I've been getting nitrite readings of 0.25. The nitrate is 0, PH is 7.6 and I keep the temp around 77F. The lady at my lfs tested my tap water which contains 1.0 ppm of ammonia. She said I would need to buy R/O water instead of using the tap water. I've been doing 20% water changes about every 4-5 days with both R/O and tap water. Yesterday I noticed that my Mickey Mouse platy was hiding alot and pooping a lot. Today she seems a little better but she is not acting "normal", at least compared to how she usually acts. She stays in one place for long periods at the bottom of the tank except for feeding time when she joins in. I have noticed that she is rubbing against object in the tank a little and at times she twitches and shakes her body in a violent way. What is going on? I am sure I have probably been overfeeding them so I started cutting that down today. I added aquarium salt to the water as suggested on the container yesterday when I did a 20% water change.
I am really confused about whether or not to do partail water changes while my tank is trying to cycle because one lfs says to do them at least once per week to keep the toxins down and another says NOT to do any water changes while the tank is cycling, just stir up the gravel to allow all the poop to go into the filter so it can create the good bugs. Should I do them or not? Please help! Can anyone tell me what might be going on with my platy? Also, why is the ammonia still at 0.25 when I am getting a nitrite reading? Any suggestions? Thanks!
Lisa

Darlene

We have 1ppm of ammonia in our tap water and we also cycled with fish, not knowing better before we found this site. After talking to some people on here I did 50% daily water changes with half tap water and half spring water from the store. Also we added Prime to the water changes. It helped us get through the rest of our cycle without losing more fish.

Good luck.

scorpiogirl

Thanks Darlene!

Can anyone else make some suggestions, please. Don't know what I would do without you all!!!!!!

Lucy

I know you've been trying so hard.

Daily water changes are a must when you're cycling with fish (unless you're usinf Bio Spria). Please don't let the LFS tell you any different.
Remember they're the ones that let you buy fish before your tank was ready.

I'm sorry I can't be of more help. Good luck.

HatchetHaven

Once a day when you are cycling water changes! Ammonia and nitrite meanings means the ammonia is converting into nitrite. You platy sounds like she has parasites like Ick. Do you notice any white spots, or other unusual things on her body?

scorpiogirl

No, no white spots. She looks fine, just acting weird. Is it ok to use my tap water for the daily water change (since it has 1.0 ppm ammonia in it) as long as I am adding Prime? Is a 20% change ok?

MrsM3197

"I have noticed that she is rubbing against object in the tank a little and at times she twitches and shakes her body in a violent way. What is going on?"

Sounds like a parasite like velvet or ich. This is what I found off the freshwater fish disease site.
"Velvet looks a lot like ich but velvet shows up as smaller yellow or gray dusty spots on the fish. Tropical fish with velvet will have rapid gill movement and may be rubbing on surfaces in the tank."
Of course with the ammonia readings you are getting, you are probably seeing signs of ammonia poisioning. My best guess is that if the fish is already weakened by the ammonia poisioning it wouldn't be terribly hard for a parasite like ich or velvet to attack. I've read a hints from the other members on here about using garlic in the tank to help with fungi and parasites, works great too. Raise the temp (slowly) in your tank to 82, if it is a parasite making platy uncomfortable, parasites don't like warmer water. Do your 25-30% water changes, remember just changes, no all out tank vac and scrub. All that is just stuff I've read, I hope somebody else can get you some good info. Good Luck!

scorpiogirl

how does the garlic thing work? how much, how do I prepare it? do they eat it?

jdhef

Okay, stay calm, we'll help you get through this (and you will get through this!)

Step 1: If you are still using Zeolite, remove it and stop using it. Zeolite is only stopping your tank from cycling.

Step 2: Do 50% water changes every day using Stress Coat until your tank finishes cycling. (It may possibly take less than a week since you are showing nitrites also using Stress Coat may help your platy).

Step 3: Stop using aquarium salt. Most people seem to think it has no positive effect.

You really just need to get through the cycle.
Sadly, I think that using your tap water is a bad idea, since it contains ammonia. I know this is a financial hardship, but I don't think you have any choice. As I said previously, you can by bottled water or R.O.water. I think R.O. water is more expensive (but I'll bet your lfs sells it).

Also, if you don't have an API test kit, it would be a good idea to get one. That way you can test your own tap water and tank water. Also, maybe someone close by has good tap water that you could use. (See your test kit could come in hand there too.)

If you have any more questions feel free to post, everyone here wants to see you suceed, and we all come here becuase we want to help!

jdhef

If you use a product like Garlic Gaurd, you can either add a few drops to their food before feeding them, or add a few drops directly to the tank water. If you go to Drs Foster & Smiths website and search for Garlic Gaurd it will tell you how to use it and what it helps with.

You also can use the garlic that you can buy in jars at the supermarket (while there you can pick up some bottled water). It is the type that comes packed in juice. You can mix this juice with their food, just like with the garlic gaurd. You can also cut the garlic into small, mouth size pieces and feed it to the fish. Avoid the temptation to make pizza with the garlic and feed the fish pizza...it will make them fat and then they'll insist on beer.

Also, if you do order from Drs Foster & Smith (or go to your lfs) look for Vitachem (I hope I'm remembering the name correctly). It would help your fish out also.

scorpiogirl

I will remove the Zeolite and stop using the aquarium salt. I am using Prime, is that the same as stress coat? I will buy the R/O water if you think it is best. I bought a test kit and have been using it. Thank you so much!
Lisa

scorpiogirl

BTW, do I need to vacuum the gravel when I do the water change or not?

jdhef

The main difference between Prime and Stress Coat is both condition the water, but Stress Coat contains Aloe Vera which helps the fishes slime coat, where Prime makes ammonia non toxic to the fish for 24 hours. It would probably be a good idea to use both.

It doesn't have to be R/O water, but it does have to be water with no ammonia in it, so whatever works beat for you.

You are welcome so much!

HatchetHaven

Prime should take out the ammonia, so it's safe. I'm slightly concerned as to why you have ammonia in your water, being a bi-product of waste... Are you sure it's safe to drink?