Reputation System

[Butterfly]

Stradius011 !! Long time no see
Steve we will just have to see how it goes. Mike is always finding new things to make our site better. Somethings work some don't and he's not a bit bashful about removing/changing the things that don't work
Carol

[Shawnie]

I have issues with mine..it always tells me to spread the wealth around LOL and ive only hit it once...but I make sure I let others know how much their time and advice is appreciated even if I cant click on the snowflakes and leave comments... it worked for a few days for me tho

[Chief_waterchanger]

It doesn't allow you to leave feedback for the same people without first leaving it for others. That is a method of preventing cronieism. Oh and that is a scale.

[Shawnie]

I didnt lol.. it was separate ppl with different threads even ...ive gotta tons of errors today for some reason..maybe im in time out!! LOL

[Lucy]

Originally Posted by Shawnie

I have issues with mine..it always tells me to spread the wealth around LOL and ive only hit it once...but I make sure I let others know how much their time and advice is appreciated even if I cant click on the snowflakes and leave comments... it worked for a few days for me tho

I get that message too, Shawnie. I think I mention it on the first page of this thread.

[Mike]

Originally Posted by Steve113

That's not what I meant at all.
There are people here who are well known and others no so.

The friends and well known folk will 'big up' eachother's posts, and those of us who are not sitting on 70000000 post's won't get credit. I've seen it happen before - I'm not complaining. Just that's how it works.

As the old saying goes: "It's not what you know, it's who you know"

Sorry If I mislead/ofended anyone.
But it's simply a fact that I have noticed. More of an observation than a complaint.

I was trying to think of a way to help newer members on the forum quickly see who they can trust vs. someone's advice that may be questionable. Folks are always complaining about getting two or more different opinions when it comes to fishkeeping. Ideally, if you see someone with a high rep you should be able to trust more of what they have to say. In a perfect forum world anyway. If we start to see people with high reps giving out bad advice then that will be end of the reputation system.

I gave all the moderators the max reputation for two reasons:

1. I completely trust all of them with the management of the forum and their fishkeeping skills

2. Higher rep means that when you give out rep to others, you are giving out more points at a time. Having all the mods maxed out means more eyes reading posts and potentially more rep to more members. Hopefully this will speed up the "repping" process to get those members that make well thought out posts the rep they deserve.

But, again, if we find it's not working as intended we wil get rid of it.

Originally Posted by Shawnie

I have issues with mine..it always tells me to spread the wealth around LOL and ive only hit it once...but I make sure I let others know how much their time and advice is appreciated even if I cant click on the snowflakes and leave comments... it worked for a few days for me tho

Shawnie - I can see 5 reps that you've left for others since it started. The way it is set up now you have to give at least 10 members rep before you can rep someone again that you've already given rep to.

Example: I give you rep. I then have to give 10 other members rep before I can give you rep again.

The member spread as it's called can be modified. But I want to leave it at 10 for now at least. We may have had database problems today too. I didn't get any email alerts though.

[Steve113]

Mike - That's all understood.

That explains it, and If I'm honest It's a good move. I just didn't understand how they all maxed out so quick! :P

Thought they had been cheating with themselves as previously mentioned. Hopefully then, with the restrictions you have mentioned - we will be fine and it may well work.

Thanks for taking the time to explain Mike.

[Dino]

You were not the only one freaked by the sudden increase in rep, Steve.
I had to do a double take when I saw that mine had jumped from 3 to 10 in a few hours.

[Steve113]

hehe - I did think it was strange. I found myself thinking - NO WAY did these guys earn their rep the normal way! - Hence the alleged abuse.

Although I now understand and think it's a valid application of the system. That way if a mod Rep's you they you get increased recognition and newbies can see at a glance who knows their stuff etc...

[sirdarksol]

When I saw that, I immediately went to the thread in the mod area, figuring there would be an explanation if it were legit (and there was.)

[Devon]

So already some people seem to be using the reputation system as some sort of popularity contest. I said something innocently as a harmless joke in another thread, not meaning to offend anyone, and received negative reputation just because someone didn't like what I said -- not because I gave bad advice or that I am unhelpful.

Seriously, if you don't like what I have to say or have some kind of problem with me on a personal level, either PM me and talk about it like an adult, or block me -- but don't send what amounts to anonymous hate mail and then hide behind the rep system. It's childish.

[Steve113]

I didn't realise that you could give bad rep.

That is something that could potentially be abused - Imaturity and personal vendettas will always be responsible for some negative feedback - the same as friendship and familiar 'faces' could be attributed to positive feed back.

The system is new so I think eventually it'll settle and people will be used to it. and the novelty of 'punishing' someone will just fizzle away.

As for the "populariyt contest" I don't know if people here have even been on a forum other than this: but that is just a fact of life when it comes to net based forums.

It's irrelevant - yet everyone wants the big post ount, everyone wants the high rep. Everyone will strive to post more or hit the next milestone - to the point where people post useless posts like:

"i agree" or "lol" or "Welcome" and things along these lines.

we all know that there's no need for the 25th person to say welcom to fishlore, after the 24 before you - I think they have the message - I know I did!

hehe I don't want to give the impression that I'm pointing the finger at anyone - It's just a general forum observation - and applies to EVERY forum.

The rep system is another thing for people to compete on.


~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

PS: w00t: 238 posts! :P
kek

[sirdarksol]

Originally Posted by Devon

So already some people seem to be using the reputation system as some sort of popularity contest. I said something innocently as a harmless joke in another thread, not meaning to offend anyone, and received negative reputation just because someone didn't like what I said -- not because I gave bad advice or that I am unhelpful.

Seriously, if you don't like what I have to say or have some kind of problem with me on a personal level, either PM me and talk about it like an adult, or block me -- but don't send what amounts to anonymous hate mail and then hide behind the rep system. It's childish.

I am going to ask Mike to look into this and respond to it. This is precisely what we want to avoid.

[Devon]

I'm not saying that I disapprove of the rep system because it can be abused -- show me a system that you can't -- basically the point of my post was to call someone on their cowardice and immaturity, since they dinged me with negative rep and then hid behind the anonymity that provides. It irks me that because someone has no sense of humour or has developed some kind of personal problem with me, it makes me look like I "know less" as an aquarist or that my advice is not as sound. If they had simply PM'd me and said, "hey, that post where you said [whatever] bothered me!" Then I would happily go and edit the post in question; the last thing I intend is to offend my compatriots here on Fish Lore!
Honestly, the reason I posted my complaint here in public because it's the only way to call the person on their nonsense, and if they visit this thread, they know who they are and are now aware of what I think of their behaviour. However, if this becomes a problem, the mods may want to hear about it when people ding you for petty nonsense like this and perhaps we could petition to get rep back after someone uses it as just a way to be vindictive.
There's a way to look in your profile controls and find out what posts you got rep for and what the comment the rep-giver left all in one list; anyone remember how you get to this? I sure don't.

[Lucy]

Originally Posted by Steve113

to the point where people post useless posts like:

"i agree" or "lol" or "Welcome" and things along these lines.

we all know that there's no need for the 25th person to say welcom to fishlore, after the 24 before you - I think they have the message - I know I did!

Since when is welcoming someone to the forum a problem?
If I haven't said hello and I'm the 104th person to say it, I don't care, I'll say hello.
It's also nice to have people confirm your advice by saying they agree and it's certainly not a bad thing to laugh when someone is being funny.
It's a forum for goodness sake, it's supposed to be informative and fun.

[Mike]

I think we're "buying trouble" here. Let's wait and see how it shapes up over the course of the next couple of months and then let's judge how it's going.

Getting/giving negative rep is just a part of the system. Out of the 173 reps given out thus far, only 8 have been negative. So it seems like people are only giving rep when it's positive mostly. This could be a good way to make us create more thoughtful posts.

I also don't mind at all when people welcome new members on the welcome forum. If it ups their post count, so be it. They're being nice by welcoming newcomers to our forum and trying to make them feel comfortable. I guess I just don't get the whole post count thing. Who cares how many posts someone has? Even if someone only has a handful of posts, who cares? As long as they are giving solid advice and contributing to our forum we all gain from the shared knowledge, right?

[Steve113]

Originally Posted by Lucy

Since when is welcoming someone to the forum a problem?

You miss my point Lucy - It's just an example - Try and view my post as a whole instead of focussing on the aspect that hits home. I know we all like to welcome new members - Myself included. I am referring in general to the one word posters - The Post count boosting posts that require no thought or real input and exist solely to boost status. The posts that say Hi, welcome - to a question, without advice as to the solution to the problem posted.

The worst one I've seen on here was a relatively simple question - and someone actually posted: "Hey welcome, I'm sure someone will reply to you any minute." - Please tell me someone sees my point, even if you dont agree with it...

Please remember that this is true of all forums, not just ours. It was merely an example. If you insist on bringing attention to it, I can show you an example where some people on here have posted in every "Hi, welcome" thread one after another and on the same day, given relatively little input to the general forum - However, this is not the point I was trying to raise.

My point is that to some people, having a huge post count is more important to helping someone out in the first instance.

[mathas]

Originally Posted by Devon

There's a way to look in your profile controls and find out what posts you got rep for and what the comment the rep-giver left all in one list; anyone remember how you get to this?

If you expand the 'My Settings' menu above, and choose the 'My Settings' option on the menu, it takes you to your control panel where you see the list.

Or you can click the 'Your Control Panel' link in the upper left-hand corner of any of the profile/signature/options editing pages.

Or you can click this link: http://www.fishlore.com/fishforum/usercp.php

[Butterfly]

Yes steve113 I think we understand what your saying. But... If letting someone know their post was seen and someone more knowledgeable will be by soon gives them the feeling their post was at least read then so be it. I don't see it as a problem.
I tend to do the Hi welcome down the line. I want every one to know we really are glad their here at our site. Sometimes I don't have a lot of time so I just go down the line.
Yes to some the big post count means a lot to others it doesn't , thats just people. don't let it bug you
I and several others Mod on other forums and we see similaritys(sp ) between them but FishLore is unique in it's own way so I say lets enjoy it.
carol

[Shawnie]

Originally Posted by Mike

I think we're "buying trouble" here. Let's wait and see how it shapes up over the course of the next couple of months and then let's judge how it's going.

Getting/giving negative rep is just a part of the system. Out of the 173 reps given out thus far, only 8 have been negative. So it seems like people are only giving rep when it's positive mostly. This could be a good way to make us create more thoughtful posts.

I also don't mind at all when people welcome new members on the welcome forum. If it ups their post count, so be it. They're being nice by welcoming newcomers to our forum and trying to make them feel comfortable. I guess I just don't get the whole post count thing. Who cares how many posts someone has? Even if someone only has a handful of posts, who cares? As long as they are giving solid advice and contributing to our forum we all gain from the shared knowledge, right?

I totally agree...its not a competition and most of us can tell if its good advice or not whether the point system was there or not...

[Lucy]

I do see your point, Steve, and posting for the sole purpose of upping one's count is wrong, we all know it.

But honestly I see nothing wrong with someone acknowledging a person even if they can't answer the question. It kind of validates that yes, someone is reading and help is coming.

[Lucy]

Originally Posted by Shawnie

I totally agree...its not a competition and most of us can tell if its good advice or not whether the point system was there or not...

I agree

(Ok, Steve, lol, I did that just for you. )

Edit: Oops, sorry for the double post

[Butterfly]

Originally Posted by Lucy

I agree

(Ok, Steve, lol, I did that just for you. )

Edit: Oops, sorry for the double post

uummmI'm t-e-l-l-i-n-gggg

Sorry Lucy I just had to do that. Carry on with the discussion.
Carol

[COBettaCouple]

I read a lot of posts and see a relatively small number of posts meant to just boost the count and we try to watch out for the trolls. I think Fishlore's a great forum for not making the post count too important. I can tell you, there's no big prize coming in the mail when you hit 10,000; 20,000; etc.

But to steer this thread back on topic, the rep system is new here and like everything new will have some tweaks needed. Although, I think Mike's set it up to be fair and minimize abuse. I think it will work and be fun. Those who do abuse it could find themselves banned for nothing, as any damage they did can be fixed.

[sirdarksol]

Thank you, BettaCouple.

I want to reiterate that giving positive or negative rep should not just be because you agree or disagree with someone. Positive rep should be for a polite and well-written post, even if it's in opposition of your beliefs. In all of the forums I'm on, I most definitely give people +rep when they make a well-written argument against something I've said.

I've said this before, and I'll say it again, please think really hard before giving negative rep. There's no need for it most of the time. This should be reserved, in my opinion, for the most rude posts (blatant name-calling, for example). It definitely shouldn't be given just because you disagree with someone. For example, I would be abusing the system if I gave it to everyone who suggested using aquarium salt to treat fungus, even though I disagree with practice.

[Steve113]

OOOH I'm SO giving you NEg REp FoR ThAt LUcY!!1!

:P
hehe I guess we just have to see how it goes. I don't think it'll be a major problem to be honest.

But my comments here are merely observations, not complaints.

[Steve113]

I was given neg rep for my post here stating - "Post counts are irrelevant"

This rep was given purely on the basis that someone did not agree. Not that I gave bad info! Furthermore, if my post was actually read you'd see that I never said they were.

This is not the purpose of the rep system. - Either people learn to use it properly or not at all in my opinion!

I'm behind Devon 100% with this one.

[Devon]

I bet you anything if you put the rep-giver's name next to the comment, people would stop acting like babies and hiding behind what amounts to anonymous

[Steve113]

Agreed.
And I think it should be done.

Or remove the neg rep aspect.

All my neg rep is for nothing to do with the advice I've given. But it shows to people that my info can not be trusted.

Thought this could benefit us, but I'm starting to sway the other way.

[Lucy]

Sad that this happened.

Sirdarksol clearly pointed out that neg reps should not be given based on someones opinion. I'll add....especially on a topic unrelated to fishcare.