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February 6th, 2010
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| | Fish Bum
| Got a rather large filter for the tank, good or bad idea?
I was wondering if having a filter that is rated for a larger tank than I have is a bad thing... I got a Aquatech 30-60 gal filter for my 20 gallon tank to replace my old Duetto DJ100 that didnt seem to be coming close to doing the job, had high ammonia issues. I figured the larger filter with more filter media would make a big difference in establishing beneficial bacteria and also be useful when I decide to go for a larger tank.
Larger filter good or bad idea? | 
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February 6th, 2010
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| | Fish Helper
| I read somewhere that a good rule of thumb is 10 x your tanks gallons = total GPH (Gallons per hour)
I think I read it here on fishlore. apologies if I plagiarized :S
Regent AQUA-Tech 30-60, 30, and Neptune 30 (330 gph)
Last edited by ctclee; February 6th, 2010 at 04:38 AM.
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February 6th, 2010
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| | Moderator
| Good morning Mseraphine,
I think the more filtration you have the better off your tank will be as long as the fish can handle the current. You don't want them to be blown around the tank  .
I see in your aquarium information that you used Cycle to cycle your tank. If this is the case then chances are this is the reason you're having ammonia issues. Cycle doesn't contain the necessary bacteria to establish/cycle your tank without using if for the life of the tank. The bacteria in Cycle is terrestrial and not aquatic. The bacteria in Cycle will compete against the natural bacteria for food (food being ammonia) and not give the tank a chance to cycle naturally.
Personally I would stop using Cycle. Start with daily water changes of 30 to 50% using a water conditioner called Prime or one called Amquel + to detox the ammonia for 24 hours until it's time for the next water change. Continue with daily water changes until you have 0 ammonia, 0 nitrites and under 20 nitrates. With live plants in the tank you may have readings of all 0's. If you don't have live plants then there should be some nitrates showing (under 20) with the rest 0's. I've never used ammo lock but if it states that it detoxes ammonia then it should be fine. (as long as it doesn't state that it removes ammonia...it needs to detox ammonia).
Best of luck. We love photos!
Ken  I have moved your thread to the Fresh Water Tank Equipment/Filters section of the forum.
Thanks!
Ken
Last edited by aquarist48; February 6th, 2010 at 04:47 AM.
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February 6th, 2010
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| | Fish Mentor
| Your 30-60 gallon tank filter will be fine for a 20 gallon tank. They rarely actually really perform to the advertised rates anyway. | |
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February 6th, 2010
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| | Fish Helper
| i read the Prime bottle and it says it removes the ammonia not detox's it. it says it detoxes nitrate and nitrite.. i think i read that right...
edit. i might have read it wrong the website says that it detox's it. i swear i read that on the bottle though. hmm..
Last edited by jersey; February 6th, 2010 at 11:38 AM.
Reason: the website says otherwise. | |
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February 6th, 2010
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| | Fish Mentor
| It's converted into a non-toxic form thus still available for the bacteria. | |
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February 6th, 2010
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| | Fish Master
| Prime actually converts ammonia to ammonium, I believe. Ammonium is less toxic to the fish, so they remain safer while the tank cycles. The beneficial bacteria colony can still "eat" the ammonium and convert it to nitrites, so the tank is still cycling. | |
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February 6th, 2010
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| | Fish Master
| So after 24 hours, does the ammonium revert back to ammonia? Since it says it detoxifies for 24 hours. | |
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February 6th, 2010
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| | Fish Master
| That question has been asked before, and nobody seems to know the answer for sure. I think it must remain ammonium, but there would be new ammonia from the new waste, and so another water change with Prime would convert the new waste. The water changes and the establishing bacteria would keep the ammonia/ammonium levels down.
But this seems to be  . Sorry, OP. | |
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February 6th, 2010
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| | Fish Bum
| Quote:
Originally Posted by aquarist48  Good morning Mseraphine,
I think the more filtration you have the better off your tank will be as long as the fish can handle the current. You don't want them to be blown around the tank .
I see in your aquarium information that you used Cycle to cycle your tank. If this is the case then chances are this is the reason you're having ammonia issues. Cycle doesn't contain the necessary bacteria to establish/cycle your tank without using if for the life of the tank. The bacteria in Cycle is terrestrial and not aquatic. The bacteria in Cycle will compete against the natural bacteria for food (food being ammonia) and not give the tank a chance to cycle naturally.
Personally I would stop using Cycle. Start with daily water changes of 30 to 50% using a water conditioner called Prime or one called Amquel + to detox the ammonia for 24 hours until it's time for the next water change. Continue with daily water changes until you have 0 ammonia, 0 nitrites and under 20 nitrates. With live plants in the tank you may have readings of all 0's. If you don't have live plants then there should be some nitrates showing (under 20) with the rest 0's. I've never used ammo lock but if it states that it detoxes ammonia then it should be fine. (as long as it doesn't state that it removes ammonia...it needs to detox ammonia).
Best of luck. We love photos!
Ken I have moved your thread to the Fresh Water Tank Equipment/Filters section of the forum.
Thanks!
Ken |
I figured more filtration would be better... The crrent was one of the tings I was sort of worried about, don't want anyone to be overworked or stressed. I actually went out and got a new large cave decoration for the tank to break up the current and give them a nice place to relax and sleep.
Ditching the Cycle now if that might be part of the ammonia issue, got a bottle of Prime while I was out today also. Did the first treatment with the Prime already, hopefully that will help solve some of my water mysteries.
I appreciate everyones help, definitely learning a lot.. slowly but surely. | |
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February 6th, 2010
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| | Fish Keeper
| Quote:
Originally Posted by Jaysee So after 24 hours, does the ammonium revert back to ammonia? Since it says it detoxifies for 24 hours. | Chemical reactions in the water dont stay the same way for long, Natural ammonia is NH3 While ammonium is NH4 (H+ + :NH3 → NH+4) The degree to which ammonia forms the ammonium ion depends on the pH of the solution. If the pH is low (there is a high concentration of hydronium ions), the equilibrium shifts to the right: more ammonia molecules are protonated into ammonium ions. If the pH is high (the concentration of hydronium ions is low), the equilibrium shifts to the left: the hydroxide ion abstracts a proton from the ammonium ion, generating ammonia. So Prime basicly has a high level of Brønsted bases Which add more hydronium ions into the water a Brønsted base is anything that donates protons to change the ammonia into ammonium by makeing the hydronium which causes the reaction but hydronium ions are not stable and once those break the ammonium is converted back to ammonia. Which judging from the Prime corp that time is roughly 24 hours. I hope that kind of answers any question...or I just went over board again...how about this...it works lets not question lol XD | |
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February 6th, 2010
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| | Fish Master
| Quote:
Originally Posted by Furallicah Chemical reactions in the water dont stay the same way for long, Natural ammonia is NH3 While ammonium is NH4 (H+ + :NH3 → NH+4) The degree to which ammonia forms the ammonium ion depends on the pH of the solution. If the pH is low (there is a high concentration of hydronium ions), the equilibrium shifts to the right: more ammonia molecules are protonated into ammonium ions. If the pH is high (the concentration of hydronium ions is low), the equilibrium shifts to the left: the hydroxide ion abstracts a proton from the ammonium ion, generating ammonia. So Prime basicly has a high level of Brønsted bases Which add more hydronium ions into the water a Brønsted base is anything that donates protons to change the ammonia into ammonium by makeing the hydronium which causes the reaction but hydronium ions are not stable and once those break the ammonium is converted back to ammonia. Which judging from the Prime corp that time is roughly 24 hours. I hope that kind of answers any question...or I just went over board again...how about this...it works lets not question lol XD | Perfect! | |
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February 6th, 2010
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| | Fish Keeper
| Quote:
Originally Posted by Jaysee Perfect! | I tried hope it wasnt to confusing XD | |
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February 6th, 2010
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| | Fish Master
| Quote:
Originally Posted by Furallicah I tried hope it wasnt to confusing XD | Not for anyone who's taken college chemistry. | |
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February 6th, 2010
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| | Fish Keeper
| Quote:
Originally Posted by Jaysee Not for anyone who's taken college chemistry. | Im not alone in the Chemisty world XD Ok im going to stop replying i feel like im taking over this Thread...sorry! | |
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