Jess

Very funny! So this is what could have been growing in his aquarium but instead the nutrients are growing in his trash can scrubber. Any pics of his tank?? : )

SantaMonica

I'll ask him for some.

SantaMonica

Reminder Of The Day:

Lighting Duration: Set up your scrubber lighting on a timer for 18 hours ON, and six hours OFF. The scrubber itself won't care when those hours are, but if you want, you can have them on when your display lights are off, so as to help balance pH in the system.

SantaMonica

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Here is a note to skimmer manufacturers, as well as manufacturers of acrylics/plastics, lighting, and pumps. One way to benefit from scrubbers is to start building them, so as to make life easier for aquarists. There is no patent, and I have no interest in building them, although designing them is fun. Promoting them is fun too. But manufacturing is not my thing, so hopefully some folks will start making at least a simple version (like the Santa Monica 120) available. Look at it like this: Manufacturers of skimmers currently make an expensive product that has pumps and acrylic/plastic parts. Manufacturers of lighting currently make an expensive product that has bulbs, ballasts, and frames. Neither of these products has all these parts in one unit.

Scrubbers, however, do. Instead of viewing scrubbers as a make-at-home rig that stops people from buying skimmers, manufacturers should instead view scrubbers as a piece of aquarium equipment they can manufacture which includes acrylic, plastic, lights, pumps, timers, fans and complex parts, all woven together. Imagine the designs that could be achieved which would allow the most water flow, the most air, the most light, all in the least space possible, and for the best price. It's a designer's dream. Sure, many folks will continue making their own scrubbers, but at some point these folks will upgrade their tanks and will not want to hassle with building larger versions. So, here are some things I thought of that manufacturers could offer:


o A simple low-cost design; just an acrylic box, preferably with a mirror inside finish. The customer would add all other parts. This is what I built.

o Complex designs that would be needed to fit into the many different places that aquarists have: Above a crowded sump, behind the tank, vertically next to tank, next to a tank in a stand-alone furniture finish, or on the wall as a decorative item.

o Skimmers designed to work with scrubbers, by having one connect/feed the other.

o Scrubber lights with built-in timers, for nanos.

o Ultra small scrubber boxes for nanos, possibly with self-contained LED lights, the size of a cell phone.

o Nano hoods with scrubbers built into them.

o Sumps with built in scrubbers, instead of built-in wet/dry's.

o Display lighting-fixtures with scrubbers connected to the back of them, such that the scrubber uses the same light.

o Tank options, such as scrubber-on-backside.

o Auto-cleaners that clean/scrub/scrape the screen automatically.

o Hand/electric tools specialized to clean the screen.

o RODI sprayers that give the screen a FW spray periodically (to kill pods), possibly doubling as a top off.

o Non-destructive pumps to get pods from the sump to the display.

o Self-priming pumps built in to scrubber, for placement on top of displays with no sump.

o Quick-disconnect waterfall pipes.

o Double and triple thick screens, which allow algae to stick better during cleanings.

o Multiple screens, with large areas for large tanks.

o Ultra thin LED powered flexible screens, which could weave around obstacles.

o Fan on a temp controller, to keep water temp preset.

o Uniquely shaped T5 panels, such as 12 X 12, to perfectly fit a screen.

o Safety switches that cut off the lights and/or flow during certain conditions.



A great first model could be targeted to smaller tanks (SW and FW) that may not have sumps, and thus would include a self-priming pump inside the scrubber. It would sit on or near the display and would pull water up to it. It would drain right back to the display, and would give the customer the option of letting the algae grow out the drain (and into the tank to feed the fish), or removing the algae as it comes out of the drain, before it gets to the display.
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SantaMonica

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Results of the Day:


"darkblue" on the RP site says, "Been running a 4"x10" OHF [over head filter scrubber] version on my 15g for almost 2 months already. My nitrate reading started dropping after around 3 weeks. I've had 0 Nitrates for a month now. I'm using Seachem for my tests. The screen is just partially covered with what I think are patches of brown turf."

And "jfdelacruz", also on the RP site, says "I recently implemented this on my tank. I [originally] had an overhead filter to try and filter out a lot of detritus, and changed out filter foams every week. nitrates and phosphates were high and I had brown algae (kinda like cyano) on my sandbed already too thick to fight. I did the 2 days lights out and it took out the brown film algae. I bought a 10watt fluorescent light from carti and then cut a right fit cross-stitch cloth as my screen and layed it flat on my OHF and took out the foam. lights are on 24/7 [temporarily]. I'm on my 5th day and algae is basically non existent in the tank, while the whole cloth is covered in the same brown film algae that covered my sandbed and is starting to grow the green algae. 10,000K ung fluorescent and after day 2 it already had algae on it. on day 3 the whole cloth was lightly covered. im still waiting for day 10. also Im going on a 2nd week no water change just to try it out and so far everything's doing good. coral's are happy and clam is happy. inverts and clownfish is also happy and eating lots of cyclopeeze everyday!


Also, I'm putting together a little series on how nutrients work in our aquariums. It will hopefully help folks better understand what affects what, and how we can make things work their best. Here's the first one below. I use Salifert for my testing, so I'll just refer to them:
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SantaMonica

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Builds Of The Day:

This one is from "Sandztorm" on the RP site; it is a version of the nano that I listed on page 1, where a simple screen replaces the foam filter in the hood, and a light is added on top:






This one from "Coopattack" on the FG site wraps the PVC around the bottom of the screen to hold it in place:









Here is a trough version by "framerguy" on the CR site (the lights have since been lowered closer to the trough):












This one from "Labman" on the MD site wanted a taller one in a more narrow size, so he attached two plastic canvas screens together:






"Johntanjm" from the MD site placed screens on both sides of the bulb, instead of a bulb on both sides of the screen:






"Mrobo77031" on the UR site just attached the pipe and lights to the stand, and put some reflective material around it:






And "Mudshark" on the MASA site just drilled the pvc with holes, and wrapped a screen around it:


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SantaMonica

Well here is my 7-day cleaning from yesterday. First, here's the screen before cleaning, looking at the the edge:










Here's the screen after cleaning:







And here's what was removed:







So it was a half-pound of wet green hair, about the same as last week. Once thing about cleaning green hair compared to real turf (my other screen that's now at the LFS) is that it slides off so easy, it's hard to leave any on the screen. I tried to only clean one side, but some of the other side detached too. You can almost just run tap water over it, and the loose stuff comes off. Maybe a better design is two half-screens, so you can just pull one out and clean it completely, while not touching the other one.

SantaMonica

Reminder Of The Day:

Why Larger Is Not Better: A larger screen, by itself (without larger lights), is not better than a smaller screen. This means that if you want more nitrate and phosphate removal from your water, the best way to do it is by getting stronger lights, or by moving the lights closer to the screen. If all you do is get a larger screen, the new larger edges of the screen will be too far from the light to have any effect. Of course, the most effective way to increase nitrate and phosphate removal is to do all three: Increase screen size; add more lights to cover the new screen parts; and position all the lights closer to the screen.

SantaMonica

Text Version:

Food --> fish,corals --> Organic Nitrate, Organic Phosphate.

Organic Nitrate, Organic Phosphate --> Bacteria --> Inorganic Nitrate, Inorganic Phosphate.

Inorganic Nitrate, Inorganic Phosphate --> Algae --> Oxygen

Jess

Thanks for the cheat sheet. I did print it out.

SantaMonica

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Reminder Of The Day:

Feeding: Here are the two building block articles by Eric Borneman that cover what happens when you feed your tank. This information is what you need to know to understand what scrubbers do:

http://reefkeeping.com/issues/2003-01/eb/index.php
http://reefkeeping.com/issues/2003-03/eb/index.php

Here is an excerpt from the second one:

"Detritus [waste] ... is the principal food source for the many bacterial species that work in various nitrification and denitrification activities. Before reaching the microbial community, however, [waste] acts as a food source for the smaller consumers such as amphipods, copepods, errant polychaetes, protozoans, flagellates, ciliates and other animals whose activities contribute to the stability and productivity of a coral reef and a coral reef aquarium."

and

"Of the many food sources available to corals and already discussed in this series of articles, particulate organic material [waste], dissolved organic material [DOC/DOM], and bacteria are the most universally accepted food sources"

and

"The use of detrital material, or particulate organic material, as food source is a cornerstone of coral reef ecology and forms what is well accepted to be the base of the entire food chain"
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SantaMonica

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Here's one reason I really like using scrubber without a skimmer. My purple gorg and red feather star stay open and extended all day and night, even though they naturally do so only during the night. But since there is no skimmer removing organics (food), and since the scrubber adds pods to the water all day, not only do they eat well, but they do so 24/7. Note: You cannot keep filter feeders likes these if you have a skimmer...



Hi-Res: http://www.radio-media.com/fish/My90starAndGorg.jpg
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Jess

WOW! Thanks for the hires. They are really beautiful! Did you plan your tank with a color scheme in mind? It looks like it happened that way.
Are they open because they are constantly looking for food? Oh I get it the scrubber adds a food for the purple gorg and feather star. What would a skimmer do? Eliminate the food these guys need? (I have freshwater so this is a bit different for me.)

SantaMonica

Yes they are feeding. A skimmer would remove their food and they would die. I did not plan a color scheme, it's just the coralline that's filled in once my phosphate got to a low level.

SantaMonica

Stages of an aquarist's happiness with a scrubber:

1. The day you see the first very light-brown color on the screen.
2. The day you see the screen covered left to right, top to bottom.
3. The day AFTER you think you saw your N or P test go down. Because that day after, you tested again to be sure.
4. The day you realized, for sure, that the the piece of filtration equipment you removed last week was really and truely not needed.
5. The day you finally realize that the N and P problems you've been fighting for (weeks, months, years) are finally gone.
5. The day another aquarist asks you, "How did you do it?"

Jess

: ) I just need some time to set this up. Sounds like at least a weekend of work. Think this maybe my winter project. (after raking the leaves)
But well worth it as you've shown.

SantaMonica

I think you can do it in a day

MinxMermaid

I have no idea what you're talking about

but i'm glad to see another fish lorian in so cal!

and a SMART one too

SantaMonica

Thankx Minx. I bet you got me beat in the FW scene though

SantaMonica

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Text Version:

Nutrients, part 3

The amount of Inorganic Nitrate and Inorganic Phosphate that a scrubber removes is directly controlled by how much light-power hits the scrubber:

1" - The light-power is full strength.
4" - At 4" distance, the same bulb power has to cover four times the area, so the power per square inch is only 25 percent of what is was (reduced 75%).
6" - At 6" distance, the same bulb power has to cover nine times the area, so the power per square inch is only 11 percent of what is was (reduced 89%).

This is why placing the bulb very close to the scrubber is extremely important.
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jenglish

It is NOT true that filter feeder will die in a tank with a skimmer. If you are running a high flow system and a large skimmer then your water may become so sterile (for lack of a more accurate term) that they require target feedings. Most people I know that keep these keep them in skimmed tanks.

SantaMonica

Reminder of the Day: Proper Flow


While not as important as how strong and near the bulb is, proper flow has shown to help a lot. Before Mrobo770131 on the UR site got things tuned properly, his flow looked like this:




Zennzzo on the MFK site, however, got it perfect from the start:





The trick is to have 35 GPH (adjustable) for every inch width of the screen. And this is assuming your waterfall pipe has a slot. If your pipe uses drilled holes (not recommended) then you will use less.
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hop2jr

Would this set-up be good for a Freshwater system? Was thinking about building one into my 29 gal sump for my 75 gal tank the overflow would be around 300gph. Would this cure all aglea problems no more GW or BGA?

SantaMonica

Yes scrubbers work the same way in FW, although you could also use plants. For a 300gph overflow, your screen width would be 300 divided by 35 = 8 inches. For a 75g tank, the screen hight would be 75 divided by 8 = 10 inches. So make a 8 X 10 screen, with a half inch or so in the water, and put the full overflow through it.

hop2jr

cool going to put my sump in this week how much ligh will the screen need? going to make it in a bucket drain the over flow throught the screen then drain the bucket into the the sump with 1" tubing sound right?

Peterpiper

Ok I have a tip for you..
When you scrape of the algae off the filter, rinse it under tap water then dig it in the soil around the plants in the garden or plant pots, they love the stuff!

hop2jr

Not your tank plants right?

SantaMonica

All sounds good. Use one of these (or similar) on both side:

http://www.buylighting.com/23-Watt-R...1r4023-51k.htm

Peterpiper

LOL Garden plants

SantaMonica

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"Sly" on the SWF site, who built a scrubber into a kitchen trash can (including a mechanical surge), gets the award for the biggest scrubber harvest so far on any site: