grimbles

Hi everyone,

I really hope someone can help me with my betta! Please see attached photos - Sebastien (the Betta) has gone from being the jolliest man in my tank, scooting around showing off his tail, to a sad recluse tucked away at the bottom hiding in stones and not moving.

To make matters worse his tail seems to be getting all bunched up - see pics. I'm really concerned as he is my fave fish of all and whilst I'm sure he's not the best betta in the world, he really makes us happy when he's happy! He's generally an inquisitive fellow (see photo c) but over the last few days the tail looks off and he's been hiding at the bottom, only coming up to breathe.

He's in a 25l tank with two zebra danios and three mountain minnows and he gets fed flake food with the others. He comes to the top and appears to eat when there's food in the tank.

What do you think... is he ill? If so, how can i make him betta (sic.)?

Kindest regards,

Grimbles

Attached Images

	a.JPG (185.1 KB, 19 views)
	b.JPG (181.7 KB, 19 views)
	c.JPG (178.9 KB, 18 views)

Red1313

What's the temp in the tank and how old is it?
What are your water parameters?
It sounds like your tank is over crowded (25L=approx 6 gal). The Betta alone would be good in that size a tank. His tank mates alone over stock (If my sizes are right).
Are the other fish nipping his fins?

Lucy

Hi Welcome to Fish Lore

I'm sorry Sebastien isn't doing well.
Unfortunatly, most Bettas do better off by themselves especially in your size tank.
I'm guessing he's stressed if not picked on by his tank mates.
You're tank is also overstocked the danios and white clouds would do better with 10g's.
It would be a good idea for him to have the 6g to himself.
Here's a link to our Betta care:
Welcome and Betta Care Guide - Please Read First!!!

If you follow the suggestions given there, I bet Sebastien will be back to his old self

He's a handsome boy and will thank you with Betta dances once he can relax a bit.

Good luck,

CHoffman

Welcome to Fishlore!!!,
Poor guy, He's beautiful though...I would agree with the above posters. He is probably very stressed from his tank mates...Betta's are loners...I think they just think very highly of themselves and no one else can measure up..lol..Really though they like to be by themselves. Also letting us know your water perimeters would help too. Good luck with your beautiful boy, It really does upset us when our fish aren't feeling good doesn't it.

agabr123

Aside from everyone elses great advice, I would switch your betta to a good quality pellet like hikari or atisons instead of the flake food. they can easily get constipated/bloated on flake food and it doesnt have as much nutrition as the pellets.

grimbles

Many thanks for all your kind messages and support - it really is very much appreciated by a beginner who is willing to learn

I'm away from the flat today so will post up some water test results when I get back. With regards to overstocking, I seem to read conflicting articles but the general idea is 1" of fish / gallon?

Also, the other fish do not seem to be harassing Sebastien at all - to be honest they seem to take very little notice of him.

Many thanks agabr123. I've got a pot of brine shrimp on the brew at the moment - do you reckon that should help him out too?

Jonah

As a wiser man than me once explained on here you really wouldn't want one 10" long fish in a ten gallon tank would you.

That rule is sort of a guideline and is not cast in stone, The dannios and the Minnows fit the rule but the 1st thing to realise is that when you calculate the inches per gallon you need to use the size of your fish when it is fully grown so in the case of your fish the dannios and the minnows both get to 2"

So 2 dannios = 4"
and 2 minnows=4"

total is 8"

So you would think OK I need a 10gal tank and that means I can get 1 more fish, right?

Not really you see both fish are schooling fish and do better in small schools so as Dannios & Minnows are both recommended to be kept in schools of 6 each that means that you are up to 24" of fish just with those.

Now heretical as its sounds you could actually keep both schools of 6 in a 20 gal tank with a few live plants in it to help with removing the nitrates from the water.

I have found that using live plants allows you to slightly overstock and neither of the dannio or the minnows are big waste producers.

The problem with the Dannios is that they can get a bit nippy, they are not malicious just frenetic and they really would love the extra room to swim in a 20gal tank.

Your Betta has long fins, dannios do like to chase so there will be some issues there but your 25lts would be great for him with say 3 otos to help keep it clean or at a push say 3 panda Corys instead, he is used to sharing so you may well get away with that plan but you will need to keep on top of the water parameters and live plants will certainly help.

Once you have your dannio and minnow schools up an aclimatised in the 20gal if you do go the live plants route keep watching your water I find mine is running at less than 5ppm nitrate and if you find your is doing the same you could do worse than put 3 or 4 small Cory cats in to scurry about the bottom and hoover the food that the other miss ( Small Corys include Albino, Dwarf and Panda)

grimbles

Again, many many thanks and especially to Jonah for that really helpful extra info.

I did a water test when I got back today... pH is 7 exactly and nitrites are showing as <0.3 - the lowest setting on my Tetra test kit. But I guess massively unsurprising as I had decided to do a water 25% water change and had done it before remembering to test the water - sorry guys!

Anyhow I did the water change and added some stress coat to the water and about half an hour later, out comes Sebastien from his hidey rocks and he's been milling around the tack very happily since!

I've taken on board everybody's comments and will be looking at getting another tank for my little man!

On a slightly unrelated front, please can I say what a pleasure it has been to receive such genuine help from people! It's absolutely wonderful to be able to receive real, non sarcastic, non judgemental help. Thank you everyone... ctrl+b!

Red1313

Glad to help.

agabr123

yeah, i give my bettas frozen brine shrimp every once in a while, but just as a treat.

grimbles

Hi everyone! Just thought I'd let you have a quick update. I fed brine shrimp to everyone in the tank on Wednesday and it's as if Sebastien is a different fish!

He now spends his day swimming around the tank hunting in nooks and crannies for brine shrimp. His colour has returned to tail and scales and he has stopped hiding. His tail has almost completely ubunched and in short I'm over the moon!

It looks like food was the big difference for him; tropical flake clearly just didnt cut it with my man!

Lucy

Thanks for the update

Red1313

Glad to hear that.

agabr123

congratulations i'm glad to hear he's feeling better!

catfishlover123

Well, I am glad he's doing well.