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August 20th, 2008
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| | Fish Helper
| is my betta sleeping?
my betta (crimson is his name) will sit in his tank not moving alot i especially see him doing this when i walk in my room to check on him.his eyes are open (i dont think bettas close their eyes anyway XD[/color]ps when i airate the water by blowing into the tank he moves but after i go to check on my other betta (which is only across the room) crimson just sits there again | 
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August 20th, 2008
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| | Fish Bum
| add in a small bubbler stone. | |
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August 20th, 2008
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| | Fish Keeper
| Ok, based on your aquarium info, you have a LOT to learn. This is a good place to start: Welcome and Betta Care Guide - Please Read First!!! 1. Your fish is almost certainly very sick from being poisioned by his tank water. 2. You need to learn about the nitrogen cycle and waterchanges, which is presented here: http://www.fishlore.com/NitrogenCycle.htm 3. You need to get TANKS with FILTERS and HEATERS for your bettas - at least 2.5 but preferably 5+ gallons EACH. The betta care topic explains this, but some basic tank setup info is also here: http://www.fishlore.com/FirstTankSetup.htm 4. You cannot aerate tank water by blowing on it, that can be done by a filter, and also by an airpump attached to a bubblewand or airstone. 5. As explained in articles about cycling a tank, you need good accurate water parameter tests. We generally prefer and recommend the API Freshwater Master test kit. Test strips are notoriously inaccurate. If you have any questions after reading that information, or about where/how to find any equipment you need for your fish, please ask...but you really DO need to read all of that other stuff first. It would have been better if you'd read it before getting fish, but we'll do what we can to make sure you get your bettas healthy and keep them there. | |
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August 20th, 2008
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| | Moderator
| sapphirebetta, I agree with luna, she's given you very good advice.
We can try to help you with your betta, I posted in your thread about one of them not eating, but it would be so helpful if you read the links luna provided and the links in your other thread.
Please continue to ask questions, there are a lot of betta parents here with a wide range of knowledge.
Good luck. | |
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August 20th, 2008
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| | Fish Helper
| i have a betta that sometimes just get's a little lethargic too. wat works for me is just doing a little water change. bettas do sit on the top if they dont have heaters too, but sometimes they just do in perfect conditions. i wouldn't worry to much about it. just do a 50% water change or less and maybe skip feeding for a day and make sure his diet include's some peas. he might be overfed.
luvs yal,
fishbabe #743 haha
airator's are great for most fish, but betta's can't handle the current. besides that luna's right. make sure you have the right conditions...sorry i was considering that u had the right tank and stuff. i just know in all my research with betta's a whisper filter doesn't do much current and is perfect for the airation. airators BAD for bettas. i have proof:Animal Planet's Aquarium care of bettas. i know their right cuz everything else in the book is definetely correct.
Last edited by sirdarksol; August 20th, 2008 at 03:51 PM.
Reason: back to back posts | |
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August 20th, 2008
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| | Fish Helper
| Quote:
Originally Posted by fishluver101  i have a betta that sometimes just get's a little lethargic too. wat works for me is just doing a little water change. bettas do sit on the top if they dont have heaters too, but sometimes they just do in perfect conditions. i wouldn't worry to much about it. just do a 50% water change or less and maybe skip feeding for a day and make sure his diet include's some peas. he might be overfed.
luvs yal,
fishbabe #743 haha | thanks 4 the advice! | |
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August 20th, 2008
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| | Moderator
| Quote:
Originally Posted by fishluver101 i wouldn't worry to much about it. | I respectfully disagree.
When a betta is in an unheated unfiltered 1g bowl and is sitting at the bottom, there's cause for concern. | |
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August 20th, 2008
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| | Fish Keeper
| Quote:
Originally Posted by fishluver101 airator's are great for most fish, but betta's can't handle the current. besides that luna's right. make sure you have the right conditions...sorry i was considering that u had the right tank and stuff. i just know in all my research with betta's a whisper filter doesn't do much current and is perfect for the airation. airators BAD for bettas. i have proof:Animal Planet's Aquarium care of bettas. i know their right cuz everything else in the book is definetely correct. | Sorry, but you're horribly misinformed here. Bettas initially can't handle much current, because those awful Cups of Death don't give them a chance to swim and develop their little muscles, but once they're acclimated, many bettas LOVE playing in current and bubbles. Also, airflow from air pumps is adjustable. If the Animal Planet site is saying that bettas don't need or like ANYthing a "normal" fish would, they're wrong. Period. More likely is that you're misinterpreting what they're saying about bettas. The people here know what they're talking about, from prolonged ownership of MANY bettas.
Last edited by luna; August 20th, 2008 at 01:11 AM.
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August 20th, 2008
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| | Fish Helper
| Is the betta in the bowl with the snails you have listed on your aquariums? If he is there is a good possiblity that the ammonia is very high. Snails are pooping machines and really need to have about 2 gallons per apple snail. | |
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August 20th, 2008
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| | Fish Keeper
| I read the animal planet article, and while its correct, some information is misleading and if not bizzarre. I'm not sure if i am legally allowed to copy and paste some of the article on here, so i havent. It says that having a labrynth organ makes them suitable for being kept in smaller aquariums which is a tad misleading. The crown tail page is just strange, saying that they shouldnt be kept in anything less than a ten gallon..as if delta and veil tail bettas etc. are any different? Even though 10 gallon minimum is a bit much..people reading it certainly wont have unhappy bettas lol. It also mentions nothing about aerators, although i agree with Luna, aerators are like playgrounds, as long as you adjust the flow rate. Bettas are just as likely to injure themselves on aquarium decor and filter intakes than aerators. It's all about how they are placed, and what is chosen to be included in the tank. | |
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August 20th, 2008
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| | Fish Master
| There is a reason that the post titled Welcome and Betta Care Guide...Please Read First is titled that way and stickied. It is because it contains information that most new owners of bettas are going to ask questions about. The reason I wrote it when the Betta Board was started and update it every so often was and continues to be the fact that I hoped and continue to hope that some of you will read it first and save a lot of the questions that are asked over and over from having to be answered many times. Not that we will not answer them but now that we have 8500+ members it is hard to keep up with all the questions that can be easily answered by a simple article. So while it is hard to catch everyone and point the way to the stickied topics, it is really a much easier way to cover all the routine information to begin with and then if there are more questions they can be addressed.
But welcome to the forum and I do hope we have been helpful.
Rose | |
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August 20th, 2008
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| | Fish Helper
| Quote:
Originally Posted by joy613 Is the betta in the bowl with the snails you have listed on your aquariums? If he is there is a good possiblity that the ammonia is very high. Snails are pooping machines and really need to have about 2 gallons per apple snail. | no its not that fish my fish with the snails is actually happy with them but they DO poop ALOT! | |
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August 20th, 2008
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| | Fish Keeper
| Agree 100% with Ryan. Aerators are wonderful for bettas. Yes, they have labyrinth organs and the ability to breathe from the surface of the water; they evolved this way because the conditions they sometimes live in out in the wild require that they be able to find alternate sources of oxygen when the water levels are low and they are living in more stagnant conditions. But they have gills for a reason (they ARE fish, after all!), and they mainly take air directly from the water -- when it's available. A labyrinth organ is an emergency back-up, not the modus operandi, so to speak. Giving your betta aeration (especially in the temperature they need, 78-80, as warmer water holds less oxygen), is the best thing to do for your fish's health.
My bettas LOVE to play in their bubbles! I just keep all the high-current stuff on one end of the tank or the other, and provide lots of cover opposite (plants, caves, etc), so that they have the option to play in currents or relax in still water as they choose. | |
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August 20th, 2008
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| | Fish Helper
| Quote:
Originally Posted by Devon Agree 100% with Ryan. Aerators are wonderful for bettas. Yes, they have labyrinth organs and the ability to breathe from the surface of the water; they evolved this way because the conditions they sometimes live in out in the wild require that they be able to find alternate sources of oxygen when the water levels are low and they are living in more stagnant conditions. But they have gills for a reason (they ARE fish, after all!), and they mainly take air directly from the water -- when it's available. A labyrinth organ is an emergency back-up, not the modus operandi, so to speak. Giving your betta aeration (especially in the temperature they need, 78-80, as warmer water holds less oxygen), is the best thing to do for your fish's health.
My bettas LOVE to play in their bubbles! I just keep all the high-current stuff on one end of the tank or the other, and provide lots of cover opposite (plants, caves, etc), so that they have the option to play in currents or relax in still water as they choose. | they play in bubbles!!! awww thats so cute! i wish my tank was big enough so they could do that | |
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August 20th, 2008
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| | Fish Keeper
| That's a big part of your problem. You don't even have "tanks", you have bowls. You NEED tanks for each of them, and a bigger one for the betta sharing with the snails. Tanks have room for bubbles, and the rest of the equipment your bettas need. 5 gallon mini-bow tanks are probably the easiest ones to find, and they come with light and filtration. You'd still need to buy heaters...and you should have probably 10 gallons for the betta with the snails, since snails are huge waste-producers. You're going to need to do water changes DAILY regardless, since your fish are in uncycled water...and make sure you're adding water conditioner to the new water before you add it to their tanks, or the chlorine from the tap water will kill off any beneficial bacteria and make your fishies feel worse. | |
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August 20th, 2008
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| | Moderator
| Quote:
Originally Posted by luna If the Animal Planet site is saying that bettas don't need or like ANYthing a "normal" fish would, they're wrong. | Exactly, simply for the reason that there is no such thing as "normal" for fish. Many people consider goldfish, tetras, and guppies to all be "normal" yet all prefer much different setups.
As far as bettas and currents, even after they have acclimated, bettas do need a place to escape a current, because their fins create a ton of drag that can tire them out. Anybody who's owned a betta in a tank that had a HOB filter would say that they've seen their betta playing in the current, though. It's not that they can't ever handle the current, they just need a place to play and a place to rest.
Either way, an airstone doesn't provide a terribly strong current, and as long as it's not a tiny tank, an airstone wouldn't hurt the betta, and would, at the very least, provide a neat playground for the betta.
Devon's sort of right on the getting air from the water. While they do use their gills a lot, the labyrinth organ is actually modus operandi for bettas. In fact, bettas can drown if they don't have access to the surface.
In the end, the best suggestion I can give is to follow the link that Luna provided toward the beginning of the thread, as well as check out all of the stickied posts in the various Freshwater sections (start in the betta section, but also check out the other ones, because they have pertinent info as well). | |
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August 20th, 2008
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| | Fish Master
| Quote:
Originally Posted by sirdarksol Many people consider goldfish, tetras, and guppies to all be "normal" | They are normal, it's us owners who aren't!  | |
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August 20th, 2008
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| | Moderator
| Quote:
Originally Posted by jdhef They are normal, it's us owners who aren't! |  | |
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August 20th, 2008
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| | Moderator
| Quote:
Originally Posted by jdhef They are normal, it's us owners who aren't! | All right funnyman. That's enough from you. One more outburst like that and it's into the crawdad tank with you.  | |
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August 20th, 2008
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| | Fish Helper
| Quote:
Originally Posted by sirdarksol All right funnyman. That's enough from you. One more outburst like that and it's into the crawdad tank with you. | lol! | |
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August 20th, 2008
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| | Fish Keeper
| Quote:
Originally Posted by sirdarksol Devon's sort of right on the getting air from the water. While they do use their gills a lot, the labyrinth organ is actually modus operandi for bettas. In fact, bettas can drown if they don't have access to the surface. | I stand corrected, I should have been more clear. Labyrinth fish WILL drown if they don't have surface air when they need it (that's why shallower tanks are best, less space to the top) -- but they will die just as surely in stale unoxygenated water. If you want healthy bettas, you have to give them both. | |
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August 20th, 2008
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| | Fish Mentor
| hey sapphire. i have a story for you that may give you a little modivation. Alot of people here, and you might even, have heard about a week of my life entitled "It's you or the fish". I was asked to house/pet sit my neighbors' house and I found the betta in a 1/2 gallon container. This betta was at the worst conditions ever, as she had numerous problems and diseases, let me list them:
**Note: some diseases/problems listed may be from the birth of the fish, or from the previous owners!
1. Ammonia poisoning causing damage in gills. She now relys on her labyrinth organ for oxygen.
2. Finrot, and a severe case too
3. ICH, a parasite infection
4. Bloat, from being fed goldfish flakes
5. Scoliosis, in other words, a broken back
6. Swim Bladder Disease causing her to be unable to swim properly
7. Ammonia BURN resulting in discoloration of the fish
8. The shedding of scales
9. Fungus on the body
10. Lethargic activity
We dont want your bettas to end up like this one, and she was actually so bad I took her home and nursed her back to health. She's all better except for her bloat and broken back (which will be permanent). "It's me or the fish" came up in the title because I became so threateningly violent in the conversation with the owners, I said:
"Either YOU change your ways toward that animal, or the fish comes home with me..."
Hence, it's me or the fish. We all want the best for these animals, and they will prove to be some of the best household pets you will ever own. Sure, they don't like being petted or cuddled, but as times passes, you'll develop a bond with them, as welll as trust and a relationship. Mango now only flares (including his gills) to only me, because I'm the one in the household who took him in and cared for him. Good luck sapphire!  | |
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August 20th, 2008
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| | Fish Helper
| Quote:
Originally Posted by TFA101 hey sapphire. i have a story for you that may give you a little modivation. Alot of people here, and you might even, have heard about a week of my life entitled "It's you or the fish". I was asked to house/pet sit my neighbors' house and I found the betta in a 1/2 gallon container. This betta was at the worst conditions ever, as she had numerous problems and diseases, let me list them:
**Note: some diseases/problems listed may be from the birth of the fish, or from the previous owners!
1. Ammonia poisoning causing damage in gills. She now relys on her labyrinth organ for oxygen.
2. Finrot, and a severe case too
3. Ich, a parasite infection
4. Bloat, from being fed goldfish flakes
5. Scoliosis, in other words, a broken back
6. Swim Bladder Disease causing her to be unable to swim properly
7. Ammonia BURN resulting in discoloration of the fish
8. The shedding of scales
9. Fungus on the body
10. Lethargic activity
We dont want your bettas to end up like this one, and she was actually so bad I took her home and nursed her back to health. She's all better except for her bloat and broken back (which will be permanent). "It's me or the fish" came up in the title because I became so threateningly violent in the conversation with the owners, I said:
"Either YOU change your ways toward that animal, or the fish comes home with me..."
Hence, it's me or the fish. We all want the best for these animals, and they will prove to be some of the best household pets you will ever own. Sure, they don't like being petted or cuddled, but as times passes, you'll develop a bond with them, as welll as trust and a relationship. Mango now only flares (including his gills) to only me, because I'm the one in the household who took him in and cared for him. Good luck sapphire! |  that made me more sad | |
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August 20th, 2008
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| | Fish Mentor
| dont be. it just proves that you are a much more responsible owner than these people were. 10 problems this one betta had. however, this makes your bettas sound mild, which they at the moment are (at least compared to this betta). Take action and these guys will bring you pleasure for years to come.
Start with daily water changes with the 1/2 gallon and water changes every other day in the 1 gallons, using a conditioner called PRIME which will detoxify any toxins in the water. There are small 2.5 gallons setups availbe at walmart for about $25, and they include a tank, free sample food NOT for bettas, free sample water conditioner, a light and hood, and a small internal filter with adjustable water outflow. Using flake food and tetra safestart, you can have your tanks cycled in as little as two days. All you need to supply are fish, gravel, and some decorations like plants and large rocks. Mango lives in one of these setups and he loves it, getting suffient excersise when swimming up his gentle filter outflow, and enrichment when he swims through his plants and build his bubblenests not to mention jumping out of the water to grab a bloodworm I hold for him.
It just really comes down to your financial restrictions. Otherwise, it's all very easy | |
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August 20th, 2008
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| | Fish Keeper
| I have one that is THE most chilled out guy!!! He drapes himself around leaves, ornaments all day long!!! HE has snails (sadly) that we try to control. He has a heated, filtered tank ( not the best but he is happy in there/ he is very obviously blind in one eye and partial sight in other, was like that when i got him home from the store where he was hiding in the tank from tetras attacking him! He knows the tank so i won't disrupt him) BUT even he knows where the 'waterfall' is and goes to play in it!!! SOOO funny to watch.
NO creature is 'NORMAL'........... we aren't robots.
Take all the above advice from others as is V good, remember that they need 'good' bacteria to build up so don't go mad with water changes. It is easy to do so thinking it will help!!!
He may just be chilled by character as 'Spot' is but you are def on right track for him!!!
My latest boy 'Tudor' is nutcase!!! I never see him stop!!!!! That is why we get so hooked, they are ALL different, little characters!!!! | |
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August 20th, 2008
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| | Fish Master
| Betta shouldn't be called beginners fish...people don't seem to research before getting them. Betta are hard to keep healthy and happy for long. They need at least 3g, (5g is better) tank with heater and a low flow filter like a bubbler.
Temperature fluctuation can cause your betta's immune system to be compromised and they can get ill very fast and die. You need a heater to keep them at 78-80 a steady temp to keep em healthy. Betta are more susceptible to disease then any other fish I've have kept.
For your betta to live long happy lives you NEED to follow the betta guidelines here in the betta forum. | |
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August 20th, 2008
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| | Fish Helper
| thanks u guys that made me feel better cuz i cant get a bigger tank my parents (lol im 15) just wont let me get one they say "they r just fish" i sometimes tell them they'll die to say if they change their mindes XD ....then they say "so, go buy another one" so really im just happy they dont make them stay in those cups they came in.
that does make me feel better cuz i really cant get them a bigger tank my parents (im 15) say "it's just a fish" i sometimes tell them it'll die bto see if they change their mind and they just say "so get a new fish" so im just glad they didnt make them stay in the tiny cup they came in. Quote:
Originally Posted by Allie Betta shouldn't be called beginners fish...people don't seem to research before getting them. Betta are hard to keep healthy and happy for long. They need at least 3g, (5g is better) tank with heater and a low flow filter like a bubbler.
Temperature fluctuation can cause your betta's immune system to be compromised and they can get ill very fast and die. You need a heater to keep them at 78-80 a steady temp to keep em healthy. Betta are more susceptible to disease then any other fish I've have kept.
For your betta to live long happy lives you NEED to follow the betta guidelines here in the betta forum. | im a bad owner maybe i shouldve just hope somone better came to walmart to buy them
Last edited by sirdarksol; August 21st, 2008 at 02:09 AM.
Reason: Merging back to back (to back, cuz there's three of them) posts | |
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August 20th, 2008
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| | Fish Master
| Quote:
Originally Posted by sapphirebetta im a bad owner maybe i shouldve just hope somone better came to walmart to buy them | Well you have info here to read and follow. Your betta will be fine if you do so. | |
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August 20th, 2008
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| | Moderator
| Maybe you could offer to do extra chores and work for the money to buy some tanks?
When my kids were younger, they'd ask to do extra stuff for extra spening money.
Maybe baby sit or offer to pull weeds for a neighbor?
The 10g kit at walmart is fairly inexpenive, all you'd need to add is a heater and divide it. 2 tanks for the price of 1. I think they're under $50.00
Maybe you have a birthday coming up?
Your asking questions, and that's a good thing. | |
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August 20th, 2008
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| | Fish Mentor
| dont take it that way. The family I house-sitted were bad owners. Some damage done to their betta was permanent. All situations you're going through can easily be reverted. If you find that 3 bettas are hard to care for, consider letting friends take them off your hands, and keep your favorite (crimson i'm guessing). It can be hard taking care of more than one fish tank (trust me, i know, and many others do to). But it would be best they could live somewhere that they can live life to their full potentials. By allowing your bettas away from you, you will relieve stress off of you and be able to focus on one betta rather than stressing yourself out and constantly worrying about them. It would be a positive move for all of you (you and the bettas) | |
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