Dooper

So I have finally set up the proper lightning for my plants. I currently have the Hagan Glo T5 HO 24" with 2 24Watt Life Glo Tubes. I also have a ballast that has a T8 20W Powerglo light. I have a 36 Gal Aquarium, roughly giving me 1.88 WPG. I have two Amazon Swords in there right now, and originally i just had a the 20W ballast and realized it wasnt enough, as the plants were starting to turn a brown/yellow colour. I have since trimmed those leaves. I use Flourish Excel by Seachem every other day and after water changes. I keep the lights on roughly 10 hours per day. I was wondering if you guys think I need CO2 injection, or if I can make it without. Ideally I would love to add some other plants (not sure what kind yet, any ideas?) and adding some malaysian wood to give the plant a nice natural feel. Should I use CO2 or wait until the planted tank is heavily planted? I'm fairly new to this, so any help would be great!

TedsTank

I personally would wait on the Co2....and would check the flourish instructions. Feeding every other day and at water changes sounds like a bit much to me (I haven't used Flourish). Until your plants are growing well again, too much fertilizer may cause a real algae problem.
Your goal would be to have the plants get the neutriants so the algae can't gow.

Nutter

DO NOT have any co2 system of any kind if you are useing Excel. Excel is a liquid form of carbon & is used instead of injected or DIY co2, NOT in conjunction with. Overdosing of excel or injection/diy co2 can lead to oxygen shortages & fish deaths. Don't get paranoid though, I'm not trying to scare you, just giving you something to be aware of. I don't use Excel myself but from what I have read about it it is not a fertilizer just a carbon substitute. I also am curious about the dosing shedule you are using as it does sound excessive. How much do you add each time & what does the dosing rate on the bottle say? Personally I think you may find Flourish Comprehensive more beneficial than the Excel. That's just my opinion though & I'm sure there are others that have used Excel that may be able to give you better advice.

I have my doubts the co2 will be of any real benefit to you as it is usually reserved for use on tanks that have at least 2wpg or are very, very heavily planted with plants that have high nutrient demands.

eiginh

You don't need co2 added to your tank b/c Flourish Excel is actually a liquid form of co2 as stated by nutter. You should be dosing a few times a week but not everyday. How often do you do w/cs? your plants also need other nutrients than co2.

Dooper

Weekly water changes, I was using flourish excel every other day, as it said on the bottle, but I may only dose twice a week

Nutter

If your following the bottle instructions you shouldn't have any problems but keep an eye on your fish, especially when the lights are out. If you see your fish gasping at the surface do an immediate water change & reduce the amount of excel you are using. Also watch out for algae blooms. A little bit is normal & unavoidable but excessive amounts of algae probably mean you are using excel at a rate higher than your plants can utilise.

mathas

You are correct that extreme overdoses can cause oxygen shortages (it's a reducing agent, and that's what reducing agents do), but overdosing Excel at controlled quantities can be an effective algaecide, likely due to the gluteraldehyde-derivative component. I can confirm that I have used it for algaecidal purposes at roughly twice the recommended dose, and it worked fantastically with no visible strain on the fish.

http://www.plantedtank.net/forums/al...periences.html
http://www.aquaticplantcentral.com/f...id-all-my.html

Nate McFin

I too have used excel as an algaecide. I have also read of many folks who have pressurized co2 and also use excel for spot treating algae.
I would not recommend lowering your dosage of excel. Either use it or dont but the plants like nutrients, light and co2 to be stable. Up and down levels are will put strain on a plants growth and give algae a chance to sneak in.

eiginh

Hey Nate!

Did you ever clear up your bba from your leaves?

Steve420

I'm not so sure that statement is entirely true.

Seachem themselves say that it is quite acceptable to use Excel along with CO2. I've read this both on their website, as well as on plantgeek.com (where they have a section dedicated to Seachem products)
I'd imagine that the setup of the tank (i.e. how heavily planted, etc) makes a difference in whether or not one would want to use both, but it is possible.

Nutter

Mathas - I've heard of Excel being used as an algaecide effectivley & safely to but I have also seen it done & fish deaths resulting. I think it depends on the oxygen requirments of the fish & how heavily stocked the tank is with fish to. Either way I personally don't make reccomendations to try it because I don't want someone ending up with dead/sick fish because of advice I have given. I already get given enough of a hard time by the g/f!!
You are right though it can be done.

Steve420 - Yes it is possible but for the same reasons as above, I just don't make that reccomendation myself. Very easy for an aquarist without enough experience to get the dosage wrong. I always err on the side of caution when handing out my advice but yes you are right, it is possible to use both together if the aquarist is very careful.

Nate McFin

Time will tell...lol
I took out the two plants that were affected and treated with straight excel. Then they went into a a heavily dosed excel bath over night. I had taken off the heavily affected leaves before I did it.
Hopefully I dont see it pop back up. It will be a week tomorrow with no sign of return yet. Though I am seeing a little GDA (green dust algae) on the substrate near the front of the tank. AACCCKK!

Nutter

Try having a 3 or 4hour break in the middle of your light cycle Nate. I find 4-5hrs on then 3-4hrs off followed by another 4-5hrs on works really well to prevent or at least slow algae growth. In some cases I have actually eliminated algae altogether by doing that. It stops the algae being able to photosynthisise effectivley if at all. It won't effect the health of your plants but they may grow slightly slower than they usually do. Use slightly less ferts & co2 to compensate for the slightly slower growth rate. Could be worth you trying if the BBA comes back or you want to get rid of the green algae.

Nate McFin

Thanks Nutter,
I read about that in another thread you posted and I do think I may give it a try. In addition to possibly stopping the Algae it would be nice to see my tank in the morning and the evening with the lights on.
You seem to have a pretty good grasp of planted tanks. Have you posted any pics of your set up yet? I would love to see it.

mathas

I can certainly understand an unwillingness to recommend an overdose, but the point I was trying to make had nothing to do with whether one should or should not overdose Excel, it was to correct the misconception that "excessive amounts of algae probably mean you are using excel at a rate higher than your plants can utilise."

In my experience, and that of many others, the exact opposite is far more likely to happen.

Nutter

Nate - Not much into photos myself. I'll have a look & see if I have any floating around in the computer later but I don't think I have any of current set ups. Maybe a couple of old tanks from way back when I had no idea what I was doing & things looked terrible. I thought they looked good back then but now I know better. Between work, 4 kids, almost twenty tanks & a drag car that I race competitively, I don't get much time for photos. Even posting on here I do mostly on the PC at my workshop!!

Mathas - I get the point you were making now, I mis-understood where you were coming from before.
Beginners mistake on my behalf, I should have known better. You are absolutley correct.

Nate McFin

You had me drag car. lol
My father in law and myself are just starting to lay plans for a 1950 Plymouth set up as a gasser.We are just plan on something casual with it. we would be happy turning a 12 with it at first. We are planning on replacing the flathead with a 318 to get a little extra shove.
I have a 1948 Plymouth streetrod as well......ooops sorry to hijack the thread!

Nutter

I have a 76' LH Torana 2 door with a 454 big block that had about $70,00aus spent on the engine. It runs high 6's low 7's depending on the track & weather. My street car is a genuine HQ Monaro with a 350.

Sorry off topic but anyone with a 48' Plyouth deserves a reply!!
Will stay on topic now.