Psychlist1972

Starting a new 55g tank using filter media and a large rock decoration from an established tank. I'm trying to do a fishless cycle with fish food and the existing media. No plants yet. I also have "eco-complete planted" in there which has some blurb about helping cycle the tank. It says it includes live bacteria.

When I filled this tank, I used Stress Coat+ to clean up the water. However, I see it also removes ammonia.

When I test with the API kit, I get readings of zero for ammonia, nitrite and nitrate.

With all the added bacteria, will this tank follow a normal cycle? I've seen a number of articles/videos saying that once you have live bac, just go ahead and add fish.

Advice?

Pete

Tony G.

Hi pete. If the product says it will kill your cycle, chancces are its already done so. What ive done ( just did this) was i Filled my tank and let it filter for a couple of hrs. Then i added the Sponges with the bacteria into it. By night i had ammonia, the next morning i had nitrites and the next day at night (last night) i had 10 nitrates. You dont get automatic nitrates, it basically just cycles the filter faster than it would without the sponges. If your bacteria was added before the Stress Coat + chances are you killed your cycle. I would test it again tomorrow morning. You could also use some established gravel from your main tank, grab some pantyhose ( i used a fabric breeder net) and just add some gravel to it. It should also help you quicken your cycle. Just make sure you leave all this media in there for 2-3 weeks to allow bacteria to colonize.

Lucy

There's been a lot of discussion here lately about Stress Coat+. It was thought to detox, but as you said, it claims to remove ammonia.
I stick to Prime to detox (if I need to).

I'm not aware of the benefits of eco-complete in helping cycle the tank. The one additive many members have had luck with is Tetra SafeStart.
I'm pretty leary of anything that claims to contain the correct bacteria, so many fail.

I would rely more on the used filter media and rock and either add a fish or two and keep an eye on your water parameters or you could test the seeded tank with household ammonia (no additives) and see how long it takes the bacteria to process to the ammonia.

CHoffman

Stress Coat + will not kill your cycle that I'm aware of. It's a water conditioner that actually detoxifies ammonia and nitrite for 24 hours but it still makes it available to the benefical bacteria just like prime.

Psychlist1972

Thanks Tony

The product doesn't say anything about the cycle, but I had just noticed (hence this thread) that it removes ammonia.

Filter media went in a half day after the stress coat.

I'll check for ammonia in the am. If there's nothing there, I'll pick up a filter bag at the LFS and add some gravel to that (I need a couple filter bags anyway)

2-3 weeks, eh? Is all the talk about "(almost) instant cycling" when you have existing media just a myth?

Pete

Psychlist1972

Thanks. That's good to know.

I was about to send it to the bin, just like the TopFin bacteria supplement I had naively used to start a different tank last year.

Pete

Psychlist1972

Thanks Lucy

I wanted to use TSS, but even the really good LFS doesn't have it in stock and can't get it. I'm starting to think that product is a myth

eco-complete: It says "Eco-Complete contains live Heterotrophic bacteria" Sounds like regular bacteria not the "right" stuff.
http://www.caribsea.com/pages/produc...ted_aquar.html

Pete

Lucy

Hi Cesch, I know we've covered this somewhere on the forum. I think Shawnie was in touch with API for clarification. I'll see if I can find the link.
Anyway, according to the API website, Stress Coat+ removes ammonia.
It doesn't say anything about detoxing it.
Stress Coat+

I know this doesn't answer the original question, but I thought it would be important to mention.

CHoffman

Thanks for bringing it up...This must have happended while I was "away".
Good to know though..thank you.

Psychlist1972

@Lucy

Found the thread (or one of them). It says that stress coat+ locks up only a small amount of ammonia.

if you use stress coat + PLEASE read.....

We don't keep ammonia around the house; never had any reason to.

Maybe I'll add one of the goldies that was going to go in this tank. I didn't want to cause him/her any harm, though. Of course, when I first got them last year (wife rescued them from a stream where they were dumped) I just stuck them in a tank with some topfin bacteria and water conditioner - never cycled. Not saying that was great, just that they must be pretty tough

Pete

Lucy

I had to drive an hour to get it! A lot of people order it on line.

Here's the link, it's a sticky with Shawnie's correspondence with API:
Important: if you use stress coat + PLEASE read.....

Edit: Thanks Pete....I got side tracked reading one of the debate threads about water conditioners. lol

CHoffman

Ok..Thanks for the link. Just read it...I'm still thinking that it wouldn't' hurt your cycle. I think that thread was just saying don't use it and think that's it's keeping your fish safe from ammonia and nitrites for 24 hours while cycling like Prime does. Which is why I liked it, Just incase I had a problem, or a mini cycle I didn't know about I thought it might cover me.

Psychlist1972

All readings (ammonia, nitrite, nitrate) are still zero this morning.

Should I have all the normal filter media running (carbon, bio and mechanical) or will the carbon slow down the process? Filter is an aquaclear 500.

I know cycling can take a while, but with the other tank's filter media and decorations in this tank, I'm just surprised I'm not seeing anything at all.

Plants for this tank should be coming by the end of this week. I had hoped to have nitrates by the time I added them.

Sounds like the choices are:
- Go get some ammonia and feed the tank (too fiddly?)
- Continue feeding food to the tank and wait for an ammonia spike (too long?)
- Put one of the goldfish in this tank and keep testing water (too cruel?)
- Get some safe start (would need to order online)

Did I miss any options?

Pete

Pete

Tony G.

yes, it is for instant cycling. THe reason it has to stay in the tank for so long is that you have to allow bacteria to colonyze. If you remove them right away, you wont have enough bacteria to instant cycle your tank

Lucy

It's not a myth. The amount of time depends on how much bacteria you can seed a new tank with.
I've had small tanks cycle instantly, that means, zip, zero, no ammonia or nitrite readings.
My 30g took 2-3days, only had .25-.50 ammonia reading. 2-3 days of daily changes to keep the level low, the tank was cycled.

The best chance for success is seeding a smaller tank from a larger one.
It takes at least 2 weeks for bacteria to develop on extra sponges or media filter. The longer you leave them in an established tank, the more bacteria is able to establish it's self.

Psychlist1972

Water was still at all zeros across the board. I drip acclimated and introduced one of my goldies to the new tank along with a plant from the old (the plant will be chucked afterwards). He/she seems to be doing fine (first thing he did was eat the little bit of food I had in there to try and gen ammonia). I didn't think that AC 110 generated much movement in the water, but I see him swimming against it, so I guess it does. I'm still thinking of putting in a powerhead for aeration and to move water around the seemingly dead spot in the opposite corner.

His tankmates upstairs are freaked out, though. It was probably like watching an alien abduction up close

I'll keep an eye on the water in the new tank.

Oh, and I need to get a larger fish net.

Pete

Psychlist1972

Reading today:
Ammonia: 0ppm
Nitrite: 0ppm
NitrAte: about 2ppm (slightly darker yellow than 0 color, but not orange like the 5.0 color)

One goldfish, a filter cartridge that was in another tank's filter for about a month, a plant from the same established tank, and a large rock decoration from the same tank.

I never saw ammonia or nitrite. I'm guessing the seeded bacteria were able to keep up? Does this look like it's going ok?

Pete

Lucy

It looks really good to me! Nice job.
If enough bacteria is added you wouldn't see ammonia or nitrites.
Just as a precaution, you might want to test your tap water for nitrates.