bigmarc

Help, I dont know what else to do. About a week and a half ago I noticed one of my angelfish was not eating. At the time he was in a 30 gallon tank with another angel, 4 tiny tetras, 2 platys, and 2 small silver dollar fish. I have had the 2 angelfish for like 6 months, I got them as babies. I actually bought 4 baby angelfish at that time but 2 died right away of angelfish disease (they had clamped fins) and the 2 I have survived. Anyway the 2 I have, have never had anything wrong until about a week and a half ago I noticed he stopped eating. I let it go for a few days but then I noticed he was started gasping, or opening and closing his mouth much faster than usual. I went to my pet store and I told them whats happenning. They measured my water and told me that he has good news and bad news. The good news was that my water levels measured perfect. My pH is 7.5 and I keep the tank at 80-82 degrees. He said I am a great fish owner and I should continue to do what I am doing. The bad news was that my water levels are not whats causing the fish to be ill. This wouldve been easy to fix. The store had me move the fish to another tank (10 gallon) which I already had set up with water parameters same as the 30 gallon. He is still in there. for the first 4 days I was adding cure all and melafix to his tank, hoping that it would help. He seemed to be declining in strength. He was still gasping and not eating and at this point I noticed he was having long clear stringy feces coming from him. Also sometimes he was swimming at a very slight angle, sometimes with his head down. 3 days ago I read a million websites and his symptoms seemed to most closely match hexamita. So I found the cure to hexamita is a medicine called Metronidazole. The same day, I went to the pet store and bought it. They had me do a 50% water change to get rid of the cure all. Then I added it to the tank according to the instructions. Then waited 2 days (which brings me to today) and added it again, as it says to do in the directions (It wants you to add it every other day). Every day I put a few flakes of food and a few bloodworms in for him and sometimes he will go up top and I think hes going to eat but then he just goes back down and sits around. I am not sure if this is working or not. If it is working to kill the bacteria, I am afraid he might die from not eating. Is there anything else I can do? Is there anything you think it might be? Has anyone else had this problem? I appreciate any help you can give.

Butterfly

Does your angel have any sores on it? Hexamita(a parasite) is commonly called Hole in the head disease. If this is truly what is wrong with your fish the Metronidazole is a good first step. Next water quality needs to be extremely good so a couple of extra water changes won't hurt(always a good first thing to do) third nutrition seems to play a part. If you can soak his food in a little garlic juice(garlic juice is known to stimulate appetite) and feed him just tiny bits at a time. also adding Vitachem to his water might help. Hope that helps. Let us know how he does.
Carol

bigmarc

Ummm, he doesnt have any sores on him. Oh no. I actually looked into hole in the head and it didnt exactly match his symptoms. He seems weak, is not eating, and has clear stringy poo. Also he is still gasping, or breathing quickly. Also, sometimes he swims at a very slight angle which he never used to do. What do you think it could be? I will try to soak his food in garlic juice. But what is garlic juice? Do I buy it in the pet store?

bigmarc

Also, I havent been turning on his flourescent light because I think it bothers him. That doesnt matter right?

Butterfly

If he's more comfortable with the light off thats fine. You can buy garlic guard at the LFS or you can buy minced garlic in a jar at the grocery store and use a few drops on his food. don't worry about giving him too much , it won't hurt him.
keeping his water really, really clean will make him more comfortable too.
Carol

bigmarc

ok I will try that

bigmarc

Ok, I had minced garlic in the fridge. The juice looks a bit oily but I just tried it. I broke the flakes up a bit and put them in a paper plate. Then I dripped a bit of the stuff in the jar of minced garlic onto the flakes. I swirled it around a bit and then pushed it off into the water. The fish is on the bottom of the tank swimming upright. When I put the food in, he aimed his head downward for a second and the back up straight. A couple flakes fell in front of him but he still didnt eat it.

mathas

Clear stringy fecal matter can indicate the presence of an internal parasite.

Hopefully someone who's had experience with that can recommend an effective treatment if that is what you're facing.

bigmarc

I am soo upset and frustrated. At times I think he looks ok, but then other times I think he doesnt look good at all. The constant is that he wont eat and he is always breathing quickly. I look at my other angelfish and he opens and closes his mouth once in a while. However this sick one continuously does that. I also think I am stressing him out by looking at him all the time but I am trying to get to know whats wrong with him. Should I stop looking at him?

Lucy

I agree with Mathas about the parasite.

You mention hexamita, but the symptoms you describe sound more like internal parasites.
Have you completed the treatment with the other medication?
Did you remove the carbon while medicating?

You can filter out the other meds using carbon and water changes and try Parasite Clear.

Good luck, I hope he gets to feeling better.

Shawnie

poor thing I hope he recovers!! im not sure its a parasite ..my angels poo is clear if I feed them certain things...I thought a parasite was white poo? I could be wrong also...but im thinking the LFS might have used a test kit that wasnt accurate and maybe you do have ammonia...gasping and not eating is usually ammonia poisioning..can you get yourself a reliable test kit to be 100% sure? API liquid master kit is very reliable and it will tell you exactly what your water is without having to rely on fish stores.....if you cant find one, look for some prime and continue with water changes daily...prime will neutralize the ammonia if thats what it is and you will see an improvement really fast if its ammonia poisioning....goodluck!

bigmarc

Yeah I am reading lots of things saying that clear stringy fecal matter is a parasite.
Today I got home from work and he is looking sooo weak and just sitting on the bottom looking downward. I think I just might go to a parasite medicine. Any other reccomendations. I will keep you posted.

bigmarc

He's laying on his side I think hes going to die and I am regretting even getting into this **** fish hobby. I wonder is this part of the hobby. Do all of you go through this? This beautiful angelfish isnt even a year old and hes just dying and theres nobody who seems to know anything. Even my LPS who I thought knew everything when I got the tank seems to just shrug their shoulders. Usually when you have a sick pet, you bring it to the vet and find out whats wrong. When you have a sick fish you just take guesses and dump different chemicals into his tank hoping you have the right cure? Seems like we dont know much at all about fish. Kind of sad in this day and age.

Butterfly

I'm so sorry he's still sick. Did an extra water change make him feel any better at all?
Carol

bigmarc

no. Sometimes he swims normally. Then a few minutes later hes on his side on the bottom of the tank.

04_si

have you added any fish recently?

mathas

More than one person told you two days ago that the signs were pointing at a possible internal parasite, you said your own research was agreeing, then you said you might pick up some anti-parasite medication.

Did you?

Shawnie

I wouldnt use any chemicals until I knew exactly what my tank parimeters are...I wouldnt trust any one to tell me "its fine" ...I would buy the test kit some of reccomended and find out exactly what the ammonia and nitrites are to be sure 100% his was was "fine" ...angels are super sensitive to ammonia and nitrites and to most meds..so thats an easy fix to find out truely what it is and to deffinately rule it out if it isnt..gasping for air is one sign of ammonia poisioning as some have said ...I really hope he does make it and I know the frustration of loosing them...most of us do...we can only suggest things as we have faced them also and had others help us with their thoughts...alot of us have had the LFS say things are fine then test on our own and find out they were way wrong...goodluck bigmarc!

bigmarc

Thank you everyone for all of your help and advice. He looks a little better today but this keeps happenning and then he looks worse again. Shawnie, I will do the water test today.

bigmarc

I went to a very knowledgeable LFS this old guy who has been doing this his whole life. He said it is internal parasites and if hes not eating, theres nothing you can do. He said the only meds for internal parasites must be fed to them and if the fish isnt eating it will probably die. I asked him about giving him the meds with a dropper in my hand and he said that wont work, and you will wipe the protective slime off of him and he will get so stressed out. He basically told me to let nature take its course. The angel looks fine now, hes so beautiful. I just tried to feed him but he wouldnt eat. I guess its just a matter of time

bigmarc

thanks again everyone for all your help. I really appreciate your time and effort. Thank you all for trying but unless theres a treatment which I can just put in the water I will just let him be

04_si

im sorry about your fishy....

mathas

Lucy mentioned Parasite Clear a couple of days ago.

bigmarc

Hmm thanks mathas, I didnt realize parasite clear didnt need to be fed to him. I will see if anyone has this tomorrow morning.

pepetj

Bigmarc: Indeed, this is a tough part of fishkeeping. I hope you can pull this one through.

Please read about the nitrogen cycle, the name may sound like a chemistry class, but it's not. Some of the signs you report make me think, as others here pointed out, that ammonia and nitrite poisoning, as well as low levels of dissolved oxygen, might be playing their part. There can be more than just one variable working in your fish clinical picture.

You mentioned a vet. I do have a vet for my fish (met him at a LFS he was servicing). They don't charge as much as with dogs or cats, unless they do surgery on them or admit the fish as inpatient. So far he has prescribed treatment for one of my fish (with different instructions of dosing and length as suggested in the medication insert).

I guess we all experience episodes like this eventually at some point. I lost 5 out of 7 Red Salmon Rainbowfish likely due to sudden-death by a metabolic syndrome induced by high temperature. Those are the fish in my Avatar. Once symptoms appeared, they were as good as dead within an hour. It was the advice of a fishlorian who gave me the answer I needed to end up with two survivors.

I ended up installing an in-line chiller for that tank -for which I had to install a Wet/Dry sump filter too. That equipment cost me more than the tank, filter, stand, canopies, and livestock in it. When I see those two Red Salmon, male and female, I am so grateful they made it.

So yes, sometimes things get tough. I cry when I loose a fight, and I have lost some but then, one day, I discover a fish with poor prognosis recovers from a nasty injure, others pair-off unexpectedly, lay eggs, hatch fry...


Good luck, you're doing the best you can and that's all you can ask yourself for. Hope the Angelfish makes it.

Pepe
Santo Domingo

bigmarc

I put a tablet of parasite clear in the tank. I hope it helps. He seems the same still. How long can a medium sized angelfish live without eating?? because I think he hasnt eaten in 2 weeks.

bigmarc

he's still hanging on, when I feed him I stop the filter. Since his food floats it would swirl around too much with the filter on. but with the filter off it stays there and if I spy on him from the other room, I see him go up top. I think he's eaten a bite twice in 3 days. Its an improvement.

COBettaCouple

Have you just used 1 tablet? If so, I would do 2 more treatments as directed on the box. (48 hours between treatments with water changes, I believe.)

When our angel Fred had parasites, it took 3 treatments of parasite clear before he started to show improvement.

If you can get frozen bloodworms, we like Hikari brand, feeding him some thawed worms is what I'd recommend for his diet until he's better. The protein will be helpful.

Fish protector, Garlic Guard and Vita-Chem would also be good supplements to add to the tank daily to boost his immune system and help him recover.

04_si

how is he doing today?

bigmarc

I read somewhere to boost his water temp all the way up to 95 degrees which will make him feel better and eat. I did this 2 days ago and today he tried to eat. I am going to buy some anti-parasite flake today and try feeding him this.